Saturday, October 17, 2009

[Avid-L2] OT: Fans of Stephen Colbert?

New "interview simulator" kit available from his website.

http://community.colbertnation.com/better-know-your-district

Stop complaining about FCP and use your "higher paid" Avid
editing skills to enter this contest. I think you might win a coffee mug or
something.

mark

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[Avid-L2] OT: Coolist Stop motion you'll see in a while.

http://vimeo.com/6605263


Rick Emery
www.rickemery.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

I'm in a small market outside of Philly - and editor only, no gear, goes
between $350 and $450 a day. Double that for a decent MC suite with a
DVCam or Beta deck, and track lighting. If you have a really nice,
sound isolated suite with a kitchen, you can triple that.

Of course, lately I do a lot of my rough cutting at the kitchen table on
a Mac Pro, so then I'm really making out....

Mark

On 10/16/09 7:42 PM, Steve Hullfish wrote:
>
> My numbers were freelance numbers with NO equipment or room. Strictly
> for a guy or gal to walk into an edit suite and sit down and start
> pushing buttons.
>
> When I cut on my Symphony that's a different story.
>
> On Oct 16, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Neil Kordalchuk wrote:
>
> > I'll throw out a couple numbers as I've always wanted to know if we
> > are too
> > high or too low.
> >
> > Media Composer 9000XL - $130/Hour
> >
> > FCP - $90/Hour
> >
> > AVID Express Pro - $75/Hour
> >
> > I'm in a small market.
> >
> > Neil Kordalchuk
> > President - Impact Productions Inc.
> > www.impactproductions.ca
> > 5228 Main St.
> > PO Box 1
> > St. Andrews, Manitoba, Canada
> > R1A 3A8
> > Ph: (204) 338-8279 Ext. 11
> > Fx: (204) 482-7190
> > E-Mail: neil@impactproductions.ca <mailto:neil%40impactproductions.ca>
> > E-Mail info@impactproductions.ca <mailto:info%40impactproductions.ca>
> >
> > This message contains confidential information and is intended only
> > for the
> > individual named. If the reader is not the intended recipient or the
> > agent
> > thereof, you are hereby notified that any dissemination,
> > distribution or
> > copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. Please notify the
> > sender
> > immediately by return e-mail if you have received this e-mail by
> > mistake and
> > delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be
> > guaranteed to be secure or error free as information could be
> > intercepted,
> > corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain
> > viruses.
> > The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or
> > omissions
> > in the contents of this message, which arise as a result of e-mail
> > transmission.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

--
Owner/Director
S.R. Film & Video
195 W Broad St
Salunga PA 17538


Cinematography, Still Photography, Copy Writing,
Post Production, Web Hosting & Design

Office: 717-393-5504 ex 142
Cell: 717-203-0976
Fax: 717-393-1833

www.SR-Pro.com <http://www.sr-pro.com/>


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[Avid-L2] Re: Finding Still Image in Pan and Zoom Effect?

No if it can't find the image it asks for it by name so there is metadata to tell the effect which image was loaded. Unless the effect can't find the image there is no way I'm seeing of determining what the image name is. I'm well aware that the offline people should have put a slug in underneath but the effect does allow you to choose video as the background and in that case you can't have the image under the effect. It does seem that the behavior has changed and it no longer stops you every time you hit a missing image with a dialogue box to find that particular image, perhaps this is a preference somewhere. I'm happy it's finding the images which have not moved on the San but annoyed when I need to know their name.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Benjamin Hershleder <Ben@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> If I'm remembering correctly...
> Avid's Pan and & Zoom plug-in does _not_ indicate the image to which
> it is pointing/connected to in any way.
> Avid's suggested workflow is to first import the file and cut that
> clip into the timeline so that the name of the still will appear
> rather than just using the plug-in on Filler. If you'd rather not do
> that, then the only other solution I can think of is a locator which
> includes the name of the still.
>
> HTH... at least for the future, anyway...
>
> B
>
> Benjamin Hershleder
> http://ContactBen.com
>
> Wear It In Post!
> Fun T-shirts, mousepads & more
> for Post Production Professionals
> http://www.WearItInPost.com
>
> On Oct 17, 2009, at 1:50 PM, John Moore wrote:
>
> > In moving pictures I can get the name of the still imported on the
> > timeline. If a still is connected to a Pan and Zoom effect and
> > someone has not put a slug of the imported still underneath how can
> > I find the image name? In this case I had a still properly linked
> > but I wanted to find the original still to modify it in Photoshop.
> > Since the Pan and Zoom had an image already mapped, but no import of
> > the still underneath, when I hit load image it just says pick an
> > image in the dialogue box. I ended up taking a subsequence of the
> > effect to my laptop system which was not connected to any media and
> > then opened the effect and hit the load image button and then it
> > asked for the still by name. There must or should be an easier way
> > to find the image name used in a Pan and Zoom. Anybody got a
> > suggestion?
> >
> > John Moore
> >
> > Barking Trout Productions
> >
> > Studio City, CA
> >
> > bigfish@...
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>


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Re: [Avid-L2] Finding Still Image in Pan and Zoom Effect?

If I'm remembering correctly...
Avid's Pan and & Zoom plug-in does _not_ indicate the image to which
it is pointing/connected to in any way.
Avid's suggested workflow is to first import the file and cut that
clip into the timeline so that the name of the still will appear
rather than just using the plug-in on Filler. If you'd rather not do
that, then the only other solution I can think of is a locator which
includes the name of the still.

HTH... at least for the future, anyway...

B

Benjamin Hershleder
http://ContactBen.com

Wear It In Post!
Fun T-shirts, mousepads & more
for Post Production Professionals
http://www.WearItInPost.com

On Oct 17, 2009, at 1:50 PM, John Moore wrote:

> In moving pictures I can get the name of the still imported on the
> timeline. If a still is connected to a Pan and Zoom effect and
> someone has not put a slug of the imported still underneath how can
> I find the image name? In this case I had a still properly linked
> but I wanted to find the original still to modify it in Photoshop.
> Since the Pan and Zoom had an image already mapped, but no import of
> the still underneath, when I hit load image it just says pick an
> image in the dialogue box. I ended up taking a subsequence of the
> effect to my laptop system which was not connected to any media and
> then opened the effect and hit the load image button and then it
> asked for the still by name. There must or should be an easier way
> to find the image name used in a Pan and Zoom. Anybody got a
> suggestion?
>
> John Moore
>
> Barking Trout Productions
>
> Studio City, CA
>
> bigfish@pacbell.net
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[Avid-L2] Finding Still Image in Pan and Zoom Effect?

In moving pictures I can get the name of the still imported on the timeline.  If a still is connected to a Pan and Zoom effect and someone has not put a slug of the imported still underneath how can I find the image name?  In this case I had a still properly linked but I wanted to find the original still to modify it in Photoshop.  Since the Pan and Zoom had an image already mapped, but no import of the still underneath, when I hit load image it just says pick an image in the dialogue box.  I ended up taking a subsequence of the effect to my laptop system which was not connected to any media and then opened the effect and hit the load image button and then it asked for the still by name.  There must or should be an easier way to find the image name used in a Pan and Zoom.  Anybody got a suggestion?


John Moore

Barking Trout Productions

Studio City, CA

bigfish@pacbell.net

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

Of course there are market forces at work, but why have the market forces hit my clients worse than they've hit me?
I guess this could change. Perhaps at some point the people who pay for media will decide that they can get the whole thing done more cheaply in India, including the editing, but I have to think that for the moment at least there are cultural literacy issues. It still leaves the question of why producers seem to have been the first ones to suffer. The way they've themselves have explained it to me is that now that the available broadcast bandwidth is sliced up into hundreds of tiny slivers, no maker of content really wants to pay that much for a given product, because they're no longer guaranteed very much audience. So far the competition that's bringing their rates down seems to be within the US, not across the global market, and it seems to have affected them disproportionately. Why?

Shirley


-----Original Message-----
From: Terence Curren <tcurren@aol.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, Oct 17, 2009 12:16 pm
Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?


--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, guanacaa@... wrote:


<< I guess I see it disproportionately applied within my industry, and I've been
seeing it since long before the latest economic crisis. This started back in the
90s or before.>>

It's all part of the global economy. When you compete with the entire
world, you rates have to come in line with the the rest of the world. It started
in manufacturing, and has moved across other sectors. Unless we increase
production of items the rest of the world wants and can't create less
expensivley, this trend is just going to continue. These are market forces at
work.

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[Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, guanacaa@... wrote:


<< I guess I see it disproportionately applied within my industry, and I've been seeing it since long before the latest economic crisis. This started back in the 90s or before.>>

It's all part of the global economy. When you compete with the entire world, you rates have to come in line with the the rest of the world. It started in manufacturing, and has moved across other sectors. Unless we increase production of items the rest of the world wants and can't create less expensivley, this trend is just going to continue. These are market forces at work.

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

I guess I see it disproportionately applied within my industry, and I've been seeing it since long before the latest economic crisis. This started back in the 90s or before.
Shirley


-----Original Message-----
From: Terence Curren <tcurren@aol.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 10:17 pm
Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?


--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, guanacaa@... wrote:


<< The ones who have suffered horribly are my clients, who seem to be expected
to do their job for the love of it. They're working longer days for less than
they made before, and it's truly shameful.>>

Almost everyone is. It's not just our industry. If you want to make more
money, join a growing profession like video gaming.

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: AMA with DVCPro25 & DVCPro50

Great, thanks for the info!

Tim Selander

pleasecallmebob wrote:
> All of the P2 codecs are supported including DV25 and 50.
>
> Bob
> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Tim Selander <selander@...> wrote:
>> Have searched but can't come up with definitive info. Does the AMA
>> mounting of P2 cards work also with DVCPro25 & 50 material, or only
>> DVCProHD and AVC-intra? Now on MC 3.5, Mac.
>>
>> Am taking delivery of new cameras next week and trying to think through
>> the work flow. Thanks.
>>
>> Tim Selander
>> Tokyo, Japan
>>


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Re: [Avid-L2] SubCap and Language accents

Good..
I just ran a test with Subbits txt output, and it works fine with special
chars.
For the archives: entering special chars in the plugin itself does NOT
work...

Bouke

VideoToolShed
van Oldenbarneveltstraat 33
6512 AS NIJMEGEN
The Netherlands
+31 24 3553311
www.videotoolshed.com
For large files:
http://dropbox.yousendit.com/BoukeVahl998172
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Gillet" <jsg5403@yahoo.com>
To: <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 16, 2009 7:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] SubCap and Language accents


>I am just using at to import text manually for subtitles I also just
>figured out how to make it work.
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Jason Gillet
> Editor/Engineer
> Moving Pictures NYC
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Bouke <bouke@editb.nl>
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, October 16, 2009 11:05:25 AM
> Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] SubCap and Language accents
>
>
> Jason,
> Are you using text or EBU STL files as input?
>
> Bouke
>
> VideoToolShed
> van Oldenbarneveltstraa t 33
> 6512 AS NIJMEGEN
> The Netherlands
> +31 24 3553311
> www.videotoolshed. com
> For large files:
> http://dropbox. yousendit. com/BoukeVahl998 172
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Gillet" <jsg5403@yahoo. com>
> To: <Avid-L2@yahoogroups .com>
> Sent: Friday, October 16, 2009 4:18 PM
> Subject: [Avid-L2] SubCap and Language accents
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Trying out the SubCap for first time and I'm noticing that I can't get
>> the
>> Language accents to translate on the screen. I'm on a pc and the font
>> (Arial) has no problem showing up properly in the effects mode in the box
>> but it won't show up properly on the screen.
>>
>> Any clues as to how to make this work?
>>
>> Jason Gillet
>> Editor/Engineer
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>


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Friday, October 16, 2009

Re: [Avid-L2] New Nikon D3

I just pulled this little tidbit from a post by Daniel Browning on the
cinematographer's mailing list:

That's correct. When used at the same f-number and ISO as the 5D2, it is
slightly noisier. The reason for this is that the 5D2 and 7D have the
same
performance per area, but the 5D2 has more area, and therefore less
noise.

If you stop down the 5D2 so that it has the same DOF as the 7D by
applying
the 1.6X crop factor to the f-number, then increase the ISO to
compensate
(ISO * 1.6^2), then the noise comes out the same. This has several
implications:

* When the 7D and 5D2 are used at the same DOF, then noise is the same.
* The 7D does not have a "deep DOF advantage".
* The 5D2 does not have a "less noise advantage" without thinner DOF.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 6:03 PM, Roger Shufflebottom wrote:

> Ah, 1/3 diag - small. Fair enough.


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[Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, guanacaa@... wrote:


<< The ones who have suffered horribly are my clients, who seem to be expected to do their job for the love of it. They're working longer days for less than they made before, and it's truly shameful.>>

Almost everyone is. It's not just our industry. If you want to make more money, join a growing profession like video gaming.

------------------------------------

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

I don't really disagree with anything here. But who knows what will happen in the next ten years? This price differential may go away as FCP penetrates more markets, Avid itself may go away, there may be a temporary dip in editor wages, which then rebound when younger producers finally learn that it makes sense to pay more for editing talent.
Actually, there's a sense in which my own rate has dropped, because my day rates have fallen behind inflation, not to mention that they completely fail to reflect the experience I've gained since these rates were first established. Nonetheless, I have more work now than I ever have had, and I even have a few basic benefits through my union, and those things offset the basic matter of day rates.
Actually, in my market editors have weathered the collapse in film funding and the atomization of the cable broadcast market pretty well. The ones who have suffered horribly are my clients, who seem to be expected to do their job for the love of it. They're working longer days for less than they made before, and it's truly shameful.

Shirley


-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Hullfish <steve4lists@veralith.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 8:04 pm
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?


But both of you basically proved my point. I'm not saying that FCP
editors are worth less, I'm saying that for various reasons - which
you both pointed out, FCP editors in general get less than Avid
editors. Whether it's because of experience of the editor or the types
of productions or producers that tend to work on or own their own FCP
systems, the general rate for FCP editing is lower. I bet the bigger
cross-section of freelance editors you were to sample, the MORE true
this would be, because you get a lot more low-end systems, doing low-
end work that were FCP. DON'T FLAME ME. I'm not saying FCP is for low-
end work, I'm just saying that if you take every market in the country
or the world you end up with a lot of FCP systems - instead of Avid
systems - that are doing the bad corporate work, weddings, local TV
spots, and those people are not getting paid as well as people with
the better work.

The higher end corporate stuff and higher end projects are on BOTH
systems, but the lower end is predominantly FCP or Premiere or
something else. Therefor it brings down the overall rate of those
editors.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 9:25 PM, guanacaa@aol.com wrote:

> Absolutely, it's not really about which software you use. In my
> market I find the salient difference is the type work, and the FCP
> work just tends to be done by producers with less money.
> Shirley
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oliverpetersvidy <oliverpeters@oliverpeters.com>
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 4:39 pm
> Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?
>
> Actually I think it's not really accurate to typify FCP rates as
> lower than Avid
> rates. What seems to be happening is that there are more FCP systems
> and more
> potential FCP editors than Avid editors.
>
> Those shops that still use and value Avid editors are used to
> working with and
> looking for more experienced editors and know they will have to pay
> accordingly.
> They don't have much choice. It's a bit different in the FCP world.
> More people
> to chose from and you really have to prove to a client that you are
> worth the
> additional money.
>
> In my main market - central Florida - there's little difference in
> rates based
> on type of project, platform or offline vs. online. Some people get
> more than
> others based on who they are and whether a client values that
> difference. In
> general, the variation in rates typically has a $30/hour spread
> between average
> lowest and average highest. No minimum or maximum. No OT. Discounts
> based on
> weekly or other long form schedule structures.
>
> What I do find, is that it's very hard to get paid additional for
> your gear. If
> you work out of your house or bring gear to the job, you can get
> your asking
> rate for you as an editor; but, you often have to give away the use
> of the gear
> or bill it out at a very low rate, compared to actual rental or
> facility rates.
>
> - Oliver
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the offical complete Avid-L archives at:
>
> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>
> Avid L2, Where the Answers are.Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

But both of you basically proved my point. I'm not saying that FCP
editors are worth less, I'm saying that for various reasons - which
you both pointed out, FCP editors in general get less than Avid
editors. Whether it's because of experience of the editor or the types
of productions or producers that tend to work on or own their own FCP
systems, the general rate for FCP editing is lower. I bet the bigger
cross-section of freelance editors you were to sample, the MORE true
this would be, because you get a lot more low-end systems, doing low-
end work that were FCP. DON'T FLAME ME. I'm not saying FCP is for low-
end work, I'm just saying that if you take every market in the country
or the world you end up with a lot of FCP systems - instead of Avid
systems - that are doing the bad corporate work, weddings, local TV
spots, and those people are not getting paid as well as people with
the better work.

The higher end corporate stuff and higher end projects are on BOTH
systems, but the lower end is predominantly FCP or Premiere or
something else. Therefor it brings down the overall rate of those
editors.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 9:25 PM, guanacaa@aol.com wrote:

> Absolutely, it's not really about which software you use. In my
> market I find the salient difference is the type work, and the FCP
> work just tends to be done by producers with less money.
> Shirley
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oliverpetersvidy <oliverpeters@oliverpeters.com>
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 4:39 pm
> Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?
>
> Actually I think it's not really accurate to typify FCP rates as
> lower than Avid
> rates. What seems to be happening is that there are more FCP systems
> and more
> potential FCP editors than Avid editors.
>
> Those shops that still use and value Avid editors are used to
> working with and
> looking for more experienced editors and know they will have to pay
> accordingly.
> They don't have much choice. It's a bit different in the FCP world.
> More people
> to chose from and you really have to prove to a client that you are
> worth the
> additional money.
>
> In my main market - central Florida - there's little difference in
> rates based
> on type of project, platform or offline vs. online. Some people get
> more than
> others based on who they are and whether a client values that
> difference. In
> general, the variation in rates typically has a $30/hour spread
> between average
> lowest and average highest. No minimum or maximum. No OT. Discounts
> based on
> weekly or other long form schedule structures.
>
> What I do find, is that it's very hard to get paid additional for
> your gear. If
> you work out of your house or bring gear to the job, you can get
> your asking
> rate for you as an editor; but, you often have to give away the use
> of the gear
> or bill it out at a very low rate, compared to actual rental or
> facility rates.
>
> - Oliver
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the offical complete Avid-L archives at:
>
> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>
> Avid L2, Where the Answers are.Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

Thanks for both these substantive and open replies. Rates in my area are in the same neighborhood, and it seems the comparisons are relevant, as in each case we're talking about pretty expensive metropolitan areas.
Shirley


-----Original Message-----
From: Rick <a_pmb_fan@yahoo.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 6:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?


The last time I worked in NYC I got $650 a day, plus hotel, travel and per diem
for 5 weeks, 7 days a week. I didn't mind that rate at all, but the other guy on
the gig with me kept saying I was getting screwed.

DC rates are 400-500 a day using the clients system, but those rates are getting
harder to come by. I don't base my rate on different projects. I'll drop it some
if they ask and it's more than a week of work.

Rick Emery
www.rickemery.com


________________________________
From: Steve Hullfish <steve4lists@veralith.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, October 16, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?


I think the Chicago rate for a decent, experienced editor is about
$500 a day.

I've heard that freelancers in NYC with regular gigs make about the
same, which shocks and dismays me. I don't know how you live in NYC
making $500 a day.

My rate is above this, but at least one broadcaster in town won't even
pay $500 a day.

I've visited one of the "cable factories" here in Chicago that does
all the History Channel, Weather Channel, A&E work and they are around
that price, but prefer to pay less experienced editors below that
rate. But they do also pay $500 a day and up for on-line guys and
higher-end editors for important projects.

One of the major international corporations in town regularly hires
freelance Avid editors and pay slightly better than $500, but I think
they go about $100 either way, depending on the skill and experience
of the editor.

There are chuches that do broadcasts that are willing to pay more than
this.

Post houses in town are at this rate or slightly higher.

I know the post supervisor at one of the biggest ad agencies and
they're around $500 for an FCP editor, tops.

I would think that the "name" guys cutting spots are easily getting
twice or triple that at the good boutiques. I was never one of those
guys, so I don't know how much they get paid. On some jobs I get close
to that and I'm just a schmuck. My freelance editing rate varies by
almost $400 a day, depending on what people need, who needs it and how
badly - or how badly I need the work or how much I don't want the
hassle.

One of the big national broadcast shows in Chicago has lowered what
they're willing to pay significantly but I am pretty sure that they're
still in that basic range, with some people getting significantly
more. I haven't worked there in years and I can't say what I earned or
what they last offered me.

Some of the "lesser" national broadcast shows out of Chicago (with a
name that includes the book in the Bible after Joshua and before Ruth)
was paying slightly less than that, but they weren't making art, if
you know what I mean.

I was up for a large FCP editing documentary and they wanted me to
come in at $350 a day.

I hire freelance editors when I'm overbooked on other projects and I
get very competent editors - better than me actually - for $500 a day.

So, at least in a big market, I'd say $500 is the jumping off point.
You can still lose business at that rate because it's too high, but
you can also demand significantly more than that if you're good and
they know you'll save their butt and make them look good. My guess is
that smaller markets are down in the $350 a day range.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 6:02 PM, guanacaa@aol. com wrote:

> Once again, I would never ask about your personal rates. I was
> hoping to get actual numbers for what's common in your markets.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

Absolutely, it's not really about which software you use. In my market I find the salient difference is the type work, and the FCP work just tends to be done by producers with less money.
Shirley


-----Original Message-----
From: oliverpetersvidy <oliverpeters@oliverpeters.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 4:39 pm
Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?


Actually I think it's not really accurate to typify FCP rates as lower than Avid
rates. What seems to be happening is that there are more FCP systems and more
potential FCP editors than Avid editors.

Those shops that still use and value Avid editors are used to working with and
looking for more experienced editors and know they will have to pay accordingly.
They don't have much choice. It's a bit different in the FCP world. More people
to chose from and you really have to prove to a client that you are worth the
additional money.

In my main market - central Florida - there's little difference in rates based
on type of project, platform or offline vs. online. Some people get more than
others based on who they are and whether a client values that difference. In
general, the variation in rates typically has a $30/hour spread between average
lowest and average highest. No minimum or maximum. No OT. Discounts based on
weekly or other long form schedule structures.

What I do find, is that it's very hard to get paid additional for your gear. If
you work out of your house or bring gear to the job, you can get your asking
rate for you as an editor; but, you often have to give away the use of the gear
or bill it out at a very low rate, compared to actual rental or facility rates.

- Oliver

------------------------------------

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

Thank you Neil. I'm assuming that's system and editor, since you mention the products. For the SF Bay Area, that might be high for FCP and Xpress, since many independents will just own those systems, but it really depends on the support provided, access to decks, scopes, types of monitoring, etc. I'm not sure what folks charge for MC nowadays. Ah, but looking at your address, that must be Canadian dollars! Hmm...the currency calculator sees not much difference.
And if you're getting plenty of business and your clients are happy, you're definitely not too high.

Shirley


-----Original Message-----
From: Neil Kordalchuk <neil@impactproductions.ca>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 4:25 pm
Subject: RE: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?


I'll throw out a couple numbers as I've always wanted to know if we are too
high or too low.

Media Composer 9000XL - $130/Hour

FCP - $90/Hour

AVID Express Pro - $75/Hour

I'm in a small market.

Neil Kordalchuk
President - Impact Productions Inc.
www.impactproductions.ca
5228 Main St.
PO Box 1
St. Andrews, Manitoba, Canada
R1A 3A8
Ph: (204) 338-8279 Ext. 11
Fx: (204) 482-7190
E-Mail: neil@impactproductions.ca
E-Mail info@impactproductions.ca

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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

The last time I worked in NYC I got $650 a day, plus hotel, travel and per diem for 5 weeks, 7 days a week. I didn't mind that rate at all, but the other guy on the gig with me kept saying I was getting screwed.

DC rates are 400-500 a day using the clients system, but those rates are getting harder to come by. I don't base my rate on different projects. I'll drop it some if they ask and it's more than a week of work.

Rick Emery
www.rickemery.com


________________________________
From: Steve Hullfish <steve4lists@veralith.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, October 16, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?


I think the Chicago rate for a decent, experienced editor is about
$500 a day.

I've heard that freelancers in NYC with regular gigs make about the
same, which shocks and dismays me. I don't know how you live in NYC
making $500 a day.

My rate is above this, but at least one broadcaster in town won't even
pay $500 a day.

I've visited one of the "cable factories" here in Chicago that does
all the History Channel, Weather Channel, A&E work and they are around
that price, but prefer to pay less experienced editors below that
rate. But they do also pay $500 a day and up for on-line guys and
higher-end editors for important projects.

One of the major international corporations in town regularly hires
freelance Avid editors and pay slightly better than $500, but I think
they go about $100 either way, depending on the skill and experience
of the editor.

There are chuches that do broadcasts that are willing to pay more than
this.

Post houses in town are at this rate or slightly higher.

I know the post supervisor at one of the biggest ad agencies and
they're around $500 for an FCP editor, tops.

I would think that the "name" guys cutting spots are easily getting
twice or triple that at the good boutiques. I was never one of those
guys, so I don't know how much they get paid. On some jobs I get close
to that and I'm just a schmuck. My freelance editing rate varies by
almost $400 a day, depending on what people need, who needs it and how
badly - or how badly I need the work or how much I don't want the
hassle.

One of the big national broadcast shows in Chicago has lowered what
they're willing to pay significantly but I am pretty sure that they're
still in that basic range, with some people getting significantly
more. I haven't worked there in years and I can't say what I earned or
what they last offered me.

Some of the "lesser" national broadcast shows out of Chicago (with a
name that includes the book in the Bible after Joshua and before Ruth)
was paying slightly less than that, but they weren't making art, if
you know what I mean.

I was up for a large FCP editing documentary and they wanted me to
come in at $350 a day.

I hire freelance editors when I'm overbooked on other projects and I
get very competent editors - better than me actually - for $500 a day.

So, at least in a big market, I'd say $500 is the jumping off point.
You can still lose business at that rate because it's too high, but
you can also demand significantly more than that if you're good and
they know you'll save their butt and make them look good. My guess is
that smaller markets are down in the $350 a day range.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 6:02 PM, guanacaa@aol. com wrote:

> Once again, I would never ask about your personal rates. I was
> hoping to get actual numbers for what's common in your markets.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[Avid-L2] Re: AMA with DVCPro25 & DVCPro50

All of the P2 codecs are supported including DV25 and 50.

Bob
--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Tim Selander <selander@...> wrote:
>
> Have searched but can't come up with definitive info. Does the AMA
> mounting of P2 cards work also with DVCPro25 & 50 material, or only
> DVCProHD and AVC-intra? Now on MC 3.5, Mac.
>
> Am taking delivery of new cameras next week and trying to think through
> the work flow. Thanks.
>
> Tim Selander
> Tokyo, Japan
>


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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

My numbers were freelance numbers with NO equipment or room. Strictly
for a guy or gal to walk into an edit suite and sit down and start
pushing buttons.

When I cut on my Symphony that's a different story.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Neil Kordalchuk wrote:

> I'll throw out a couple numbers as I've always wanted to know if we
> are too
> high or too low.
>
> Media Composer 9000XL - $130/Hour
>
> FCP - $90/Hour
>
> AVID Express Pro - $75/Hour
>
> I'm in a small market.
>
> Neil Kordalchuk
> President - Impact Productions Inc.
> www.impactproductions.ca
> 5228 Main St.
> PO Box 1
> St. Andrews, Manitoba, Canada
> R1A 3A8
> Ph: (204) 338-8279 Ext. 11
> Fx: (204) 482-7190
> E-Mail: neil@impactproductions.ca
> E-Mail info@impactproductions.ca
>
> This message contains confidential information and is intended only
> for the
> individual named. If the reader is not the intended recipient or the
> agent
> thereof, you are hereby notified that any dissemination,
> distribution or
> copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. Please notify the
> sender
> immediately by return e-mail if you have received this e-mail by
> mistake and
> delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be
> guaranteed to be secure or error free as information could be
> intercepted,
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> viruses.
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> omissions
> in the contents of this message, which arise as a result of e-mail
> transmission.
>
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>
>
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[Avid-L2] Re: OT: Rates?

Actually I think it's not really accurate to typify FCP rates as lower than Avid rates. What seems to be happening is that there are more FCP systems and more potential FCP editors than Avid editors.

Those shops that still use and value Avid editors are used to working with and looking for more experienced editors and know they will have to pay accordingly. They don't have much choice. It's a bit different in the FCP world. More people to chose from and you really have to prove to a client that you are worth the additional money.

In my main market - central Florida - there's little difference in rates based on type of project, platform or offline vs. online. Some people get more than others based on who they are and whether a client values that difference. In general, the variation in rates typically has a $30/hour spread between average lowest and average highest. No minimum or maximum. No OT. Discounts based on weekly or other long form schedule structures.

What I do find, is that it's very hard to get paid additional for your gear. If you work out of your house or bring gear to the job, you can get your asking rate for you as an editor; but, you often have to give away the use of the gear or bill it out at a very low rate, compared to actual rental or facility rates.

- Oliver

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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

I think the Chicago rate for a decent, experienced editor is about
$500 a day.

I've heard that freelancers in NYC with regular gigs make about the
same, which shocks and dismays me. I don't know how you live in NYC
making $500 a day.

My rate is above this, but at least one broadcaster in town won't even
pay $500 a day.

I've visited one of the "cable factories" here in Chicago that does
all the History Channel, Weather Channel, A&E work and they are around
that price, but prefer to pay less experienced editors below that
rate. But they do also pay $500 a day and up for on-line guys and
higher-end editors for important projects.

One of the major international corporations in town regularly hires
freelance Avid editors and pay slightly better than $500, but I think
they go about $100 either way, depending on the skill and experience
of the editor.

There are chuches that do broadcasts that are willing to pay more than
this.

Post houses in town are at this rate or slightly higher.

I know the post supervisor at one of the biggest ad agencies and
they're around $500 for an FCP editor, tops.

I would think that the "name" guys cutting spots are easily getting
twice or triple that at the good boutiques. I was never one of those
guys, so I don't know how much they get paid. On some jobs I get close
to that and I'm just a schmuck. My freelance editing rate varies by
almost $400 a day, depending on what people need, who needs it and how
badly - or how badly I need the work or how much I don't want the
hassle.

One of the big national broadcast shows in Chicago has lowered what
they're willing to pay significantly but I am pretty sure that they're
still in that basic range, with some people getting significantly
more. I haven't worked there in years and I can't say what I earned or
what they last offered me.

Some of the "lesser" national broadcast shows out of Chicago (with a
name that includes the book in the Bible after Joshua and before Ruth)
was paying slightly less than that, but they weren't making art, if
you know what I mean.

I was up for a large FCP editing documentary and they wanted me to
come in at $350 a day.

I hire freelance editors when I'm overbooked on other projects and I
get very competent editors - better than me actually - for $500 a day.

So, at least in a big market, I'd say $500 is the jumping off point.
You can still lose business at that rate because it's too high, but
you can also demand significantly more than that if you're good and
they know you'll save their butt and make them look good. My guess is
that smaller markets are down in the $350 a day range.

On Oct 16, 2009, at 6:02 PM, guanacaa@aol.com wrote:

> Once again, I would never ask about your personal rates. I was
> hoping to get actual numbers for what's common in your markets.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [Avid-L2] MC 4.x errors

Yes. I tell you after I pulled libwinOGL.dylib out of my AVX folder
it has been smooth. I put back the DFTv1 bundle last night and no
problems. I will put the Knoll bundle back in and that just leaves
the libwin file. Will keep you posted. Marianna says this is a file
having to do with OpenGL.

Lou
On Oct 16, 2009, at 4:13 PM, RT wrote:

> How ya doing Lou? Anything working yet?
>
> RT
>
> Lou Wirth wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks much!
> > On Oct 15, 2009, at 2:28 PM, RT wrote:
> >
> > > Lou
> > >
> > > 7.6.4 is not supported yet. You have the right QT version.
> > >
> > > Ideas? To start, you want to ditch the old media folder and
> databases.
> > >
> > > Rename the old OMFI MediaFiles folder to anything else - Create a
> > > brand
> > > new OMFI MediaFiles folder and move JUST the mediafiles into it.
> Make
> > > sure there is only valid media files in this folder. Launch Avid
> and
> > > let the databases rebuild. This may work.
> > >
> > > If not, you could apply "everyone" "read and write" permissions to
> > > this
> > > new folder and all its contents.
> > >
> > > If errors continue with the GRAID, test using just your internal
> > > storage
> > > or connect the GTECH via the USB bus.
> > >
> > > Also, see my new post re project file errors in 4.02.
> > >
> > > RT
> > >
> > > Lou Wirth wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Mine is all DV. Maybe I should upgrade my QT.
> > > > On Oct 15, 2009, at 11:48 AM, Barry Stevens wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Had a great day with large pan & zooms, and in and out of
> P'shop -
> > > > > 4.02 on 2.4 Macbook
> > > > > pro with 4 GB memory. QT 7.6.4 with 500Bg USb drives not via
> hub.
> > > > > Sorry to hear your pain, any differences?. Mine is all Pal dv
> > > footage.
> > > > > On 15 Oct 2009, at 19:11, Lou Wirth wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > I am amazed at the amount of errors I am getting trying to
> use
> > > MC
> > > > > 4.02
> > > > > > on my laptop. Everytime I start to work, within minutes I
> get
> > > MMOB
> > > > > > errors and HPDomain_ERROR _CLOSING DOMAIN errors. I have
> > > pretty much
> > > > > > had to force quit every time I work on my laptop. MacBook
> Pro
> > > > > > 2.83GHZ . OS10.5.8 QT 7.6.2.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Are others having issues with this? Rebuilding data bases
> is an
> > > > > > hourly chore on this system.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > thanks
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > Lou Wirth Productions
> > > > > > 500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
> > > > > > Corte Madera, CA 94925
> > > > > > www.louwirth.com
> > > > > > 415-924-9411p
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Lou Wirth Productions
> > > > 500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
> > > > Corte Madera, CA 94925
> > > > www.louwirth.com
> > > > 415-924-9411p
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Lou Wirth Productions
> > 500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
> > Corte Madera, CA 94925
> > www.louwirth.com
> > 415-924-9411p
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

Lou Wirth Productions
500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
Corte Madera, CA 94925
www.louwirth.com
415-924-9411p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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RE: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

I'll throw out a couple numbers as I've always wanted to know if we are too
high or too low.

Media Composer 9000XL - $130/Hour

FCP - $90/Hour

AVID Express Pro - $75/Hour

I'm in a small market.

Neil Kordalchuk
President - Impact Productions Inc.
www.impactproductions.ca
5228 Main St.
PO Box 1
St. Andrews, Manitoba, Canada
R1A 3A8
Ph: (204) 338-8279 Ext. 11
Fx: (204) 482-7190
E-Mail: neil@impactproductions.ca
E-Mail info@impactproductions.ca

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delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be
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The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions
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Re: [Avid-L2] MC 4.x errors

How ya doing Lou? Anything working yet?

RT

Lou Wirth wrote:

>
>
> Thanks much!
> On Oct 15, 2009, at 2:28 PM, RT wrote:
>
> > Lou
> >
> > 7.6.4 is not supported yet. You have the right QT version.
> >
> > Ideas? To start, you want to ditch the old media folder and databases.
> >
> > Rename the old OMFI MediaFiles folder to anything else - Create a
> > brand
> > new OMFI MediaFiles folder and move JUST the mediafiles into it. Make
> > sure there is only valid media files in this folder. Launch Avid and
> > let the databases rebuild. This may work.
> >
> > If not, you could apply "everyone" "read and write" permissions to
> > this
> > new folder and all its contents.
> >
> > If errors continue with the GRAID, test using just your internal
> > storage
> > or connect the GTECH via the USB bus.
> >
> > Also, see my new post re project file errors in 4.02.
> >
> > RT
> >
> > Lou Wirth wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Mine is all DV. Maybe I should upgrade my QT.
> > > On Oct 15, 2009, at 11:48 AM, Barry Stevens wrote:
> > >
> > > > Had a great day with large pan & zooms, and in and out of P'shop -
> > > > 4.02 on 2.4 Macbook
> > > > pro with 4 GB memory. QT 7.6.4 with 500Bg USb drives not via hub.
> > > > Sorry to hear your pain, any differences?. Mine is all Pal dv
> > footage.
> > > > On 15 Oct 2009, at 19:11, Lou Wirth wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I am amazed at the amount of errors I am getting trying to use
> > MC
> > > > 4.02
> > > > > on my laptop. Everytime I start to work, within minutes I get
> > MMOB
> > > > > errors and HPDomain_ERROR _CLOSING DOMAIN errors. I have
> > pretty much
> > > > > had to force quit every time I work on my laptop. MacBook Pro
> > > > > 2.83GHZ . OS10.5.8 QT 7.6.2.
> > > > >
> > > > > Are others having issues with this? Rebuilding data bases is an
> > > > > hourly chore on this system.
> > > > >
> > > > > thanks
> > > > > Lou
> > > > > Lou Wirth Productions
> > > > > 500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
> > > > > Corte Madera, CA 94925
> > > > > www.louwirth.com
> > > > > 415-924-9411p
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Lou Wirth Productions
> > > 500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
> > > Corte Madera, CA 94925
> > > www.louwirth.com
> > > 415-924-9411p
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
> Lou Wirth Productions
> 500Tamal Plaza, Suite 522
> Corte Madera, CA 94925
> www.louwirth.com
> 415-924-9411p
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] New Nikon D3

Ah, 1/3 diag - small. Fair enough.


On 16/10/2009 23:57, "Steve Hullfish" <steve4lists@veralith.com> wrote:

> I think that's on a diagonal and not necessarily "active picture area.
>
> I got my figures from the internet, so they must be right!
>

+++
With best wishes,

Roger Shufflebottom
Avid Certified Instructor
http://www.bottom-line.tv
Tel: +44 1992 535 031 (UK)
Mobile: +44 7973 543 660


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Re: [Avid-L2] New Nikon D3

>the point is that if you don't have a larger "chip" that's recording the image, you don't get all the prettiness.

This is valid to a point. Each manufacturer processes the RGB image differently. Depending on the manufacturer and with enough processing power you can make any deficient imager look good. I always find 2/3rds cameras do look better than 1/2 inch CCD HD cameras. The larger imager is generally quieter has better dynamic range and has a faster ISO due to the larger pixels. I will tell you I have shot with the Sony 355 1/2 inch XDCAM HD and the F900R. The 355 has a bit less dynamic range and sensitivity BUT due to price point the processing in the 355  and the 900R are not the same. If Sony wanted too they could make both imagers look the same in every aspect except DOF. But I would suppose the cost to better process the 355's imager would be more involved and make the camera cost prohibitive for it's price point compared to a F900R. Of course the two respective imagers might be 180 degrees apart in their makeup and design. Also another
issue is glass. The smaller 1/2inch imager needs glass that is better corrected in all aspects compared to a 2/3rds imager. The smaller the imager you start with the more obvious the errors when projected compared to a 2/3rds imager side by side.    

If a 24 Megapixel and a 12 Megapixel imager are both physically the same size odds are the 24 Megapixel sensor in it's native "engineering bench" state will be a slower ISO due to the smaller pixel size. However with proprietary processing and noise reduction algorithms the 24 Megapixel sensor can certainly be pushed to the same ISO as the 12 Megapixel sensor probably with noise issues only in the higher ISO's but then again maybe not. There are no black and white certainties in the sensor game. You just can't make assumptions based on specs and imager size alone. There is too much voodoo going on behind the imaging sensor. 

Regarding the video tests linked to earlier; the test that shows the rolling shutter problem is the "train test". When the train passes by the rolling shutter artifact is blantantly obvious. A CCD imager won't do that. That's why all proffesional HD cameras are still CCD based. In the Alan Gordon test I can tell the cars are stretching as they exit the frame. If I where to shoot handheld footage with rapid pans or simply follow fast moving objects the rolling shutter artifact becomes a big issue for me. You also get into ugly blanking issues if strobes are in the scene. I'm sure there are people who could careless but then I'm not one of them.
 
Also to clear up a little mis-information the RED sensor's dimensions are Super-35 just like the Panavision Genesis, Sony F35 and the Arri D-21. RED simply underscans it's sensor to create the lower resolutions the same what Nikon is doing. Hence in RED if you are not shooting 4K you are not using the full sensor and your motion picture 35mm lens's perspective is magnified as resolution drops. 

Sorry for the bloviating,
TMcD       

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Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?

Once again, I would never ask about your personal rates. I was hoping to get actual numbers for what's common in your markets. I think we all know that our personal rates are always negotiable and that we tend to charge less for FCP than Avid. In my market, that has more to do with the fact that FCP jobs tend to be independent documentary and feature, in other words, the producers are indigent. The one time I did a corporate job on FCP I charged my normal corporate rate.
So, numbers anyone? Once again, stated as ranges for the different types of work I listed; this is not an inquiry about your personal day rate. Also, if it's not obvious, tell me what market you're in.

Many thanks!

Shirley

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Hullfish <steve4lists@veralith.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, Oct 16, 2009 3:39 pm
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?


I agree that rates for FCP are lower than rates for Avid.

I just heard back from a client that I thought loved my last job for
them, but I hadn't heard back since (March).

Today, a co-worker of the people that hired me secretly sent me an
internal memo that stated that they loved the last project, but my
rate was too high.

It was an FCP job on my own equipment and I did it for $50 less per
day than my cheapest Avid freelance day rate and $250 a day less than
my Symphony on-line/color correction freelance rate. And that STILL
isn't cheap enough for them. This is a major national broadcaster.
None of my Avid clients balk at my day rate.

Makes you think: Sure Avid is $2300 or whatever it is compared to
$1200 for FCS, but if you make $250 a day more for Avid work than FCP
work, Avid pays for the difference in less than a week. Even if you
just make $50 more a day, it pays for the difference in about a month.

Come on Avid marketing weasels: Find a concept that pays and run with
it!

How about this for an ad headline?

90% of all YouTube videos are edited on Final Cut Pro.
90% of all prime time television and feature films are edited on Avid.
If you want to succeed as an editing professional, the choice is clear.


OK, so it's snarky and mean. I switch back and forth between Avid and
FCP all the time myself. I do consider Avid a more professional tool,
but that's mostly because of output/layoff and not because of actual
editing. Like most people, I find myself missing certain FCP tools and
capabilities when I'm on Avid, and vice versa. But this is the avid-l
not the fcp-l and I've done enough Avid bashing for the month with my
last eternal/infernal thread about Avid marketing.


On Oct 16, 2009, at 4:55 PM, Rick wrote:

> I've lost work when corporate people, say why would I pay you that?
> I've got people who will do it for $10 an hour. Not to start a war
> here, but most of the time, those are usually FCP jobs. Avid gigs
> seem to pay better, or at least have less resistance to my day rate.
>
> Rick Emery
> www.rickemery.com
>
> ________________________________
> From: "guanacaa@aol.com" <guanacaa@aol.com>
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, October 16, 2009 5:46:56 PM
> Subject: [Avid-L2] OT: Rates?
>
> Obviously, I would never ask anyone to quote their rate in a public
> forum, but I'm curious as to what is happening to rates around the
> nation, and the world. I'm asking this question as a matter of
> what's common, not what you personally charge, and I'm interested
> primarily in freelance rates, though it would be interesting to know
> how freelance and staff rates compare in a given market. Obviously,
> different types of work mean different types of rates, so I would
> like to know about:
>
> 1) independent documentary
>
> 2) broadcast, meaning under the roof of any major station and PBS
> affiliate, union and non
>
> 3) cable sweat shop - to clarify this term, all those places that
> crank out History Channel, Discovery, National Geographic, and
> (shudder!) Home and Garden programming.
>
> 4) corporate
>
> 5) advertising (spot cutting)
>
> I'm primarily interested in rates for offline work, though in
> certain types of work in my market there is no real rate distinction
> between offline and online. If it's different in yours, that would
> interest me too. You can quote rates by the hour, the day, or the
> week. The assumption is that these rates are being charged by
> experienced editors with at least ten years under their belts, not
> by kids fresh out of school. I'll do the conversion of any rates
> stated in Euros or other, national currencies.
>
> Thanks for sharing any intel you may have. I sincerely hope there's
> nothing inappropriate about this, but it seems we've talked about
> money before, and if I am being inappropriate, I'm sure Jeff will
> let me know ;-)
>
> Shirley
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

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