Saturday, August 13, 2016

Re: [Avid-L2] TV editors opinions desired

 

The race to the bottom isn't all because of the Bean Counters but I was specifically looking at the irony that thinking by cutting personnel you save money when in fact it ends up costing more in the long run.  Just like the all too common choice of hiring an AE with little to no experience because they are cheaper and then you spend extra days because every uprezz takes extra days to complete after someone made a novice mistake.  Sadly it is those constant issues that I attribute mostly to the bean counter mentality and short shortsightedness.

Your more global point is certainly valid just not something I was focusing on.  I tend to focus on things that I could potentially have some control over.  Viewing habits and figuring out how low you can go without losing market share isn't an arena I play in.  I have been around long enough to have seen executives boom and bust at various times in their careers to the point where I realize nobody really knows what will work when it comes to programming.  History is riddled with programming executives who switch networks because they have a great track record only to tank at the next stop in their career. 

But of course I now see how much new life is being brought to the entertainment world with the implementation of 4K.  I mean how can you compare the entertainment value of an HD show that's a mere 100GB to a 4K ProRes HQ of the same show that is 600GB?  The answer is you can't because you have to deliver that 4K show as DPX regardless of source material so clearly the 4.5TB 4K DPX show is waaaaaay more entertaining to the viewer at home.  Especially after it gets that special compression down to a realistic bandwidth that might actually stream without stalling.  I'm sure the compression artifacts are really heightening the viewing experience.  Oh and when it's "True 4K" not the wimpy UHD, well it's obvious that the viewers will be lining up around the block to tune in, or should I say, "Stream In."  ;-)



---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <tcurren@...> wrote :

You are picking the wrong target when you blame it all on the "Bean Counters." They can only cut costs until the quality  is so low that the consumer won't pay to watch. You have to ask yourself, what level is that at? Watch YouTube or most of what is on cable these days and you begin to get an idea. 

In the end, we have ourselves to blame for not educating the consumer on the value we add. Since editors are invisible to the end viewer, how would the viewer even know what good or bad editing is? On the other hand, the consumer thinks the clever back and forth editing in a Tarantino film is all his doing. So why should an editor garner any money when Tarantino did it all?

Terence Curren


---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bigfish@...> wrote :


And of course as an "Educer" I will be paid twice as much since I'm doing two jobs now.  Most Producers I know are now being saddled with so many other production and post tasks that have traditionally been done by other staff members they don't have the time to edit too.  Yes technology has become more accessible and for some strange reason less intimidating but the bottom line is we are in a race to the bottom and as has been pointed out the bean counters wouldn't know a good edit if it was shoved in their place where the sun don't shine.  One of the major ironies is that as I watch all this happen I see how inefficient post has become.  What we did in one or two cuts back in the linear days now takes 10 cuts.  Sure non linear makes that more possible but in my world when I sat with the field director of a piece and we worked together things were much more efficient and given the people in charge were sitting in the room things were completed in a more timely manner.  The fallacy that removing the field directors from the edit room saves money is because the bean  counters can only count personnel and smaller numbers look better but when the piece take 4 or 5 times longer to finish that lower man power ends up costing more in the long run.  That's the reality and lack of understanding the post process that I see all the time. 

---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <hoplist@...> wrote :

This is the natural progression when was any technical expertise becomes obsolete. 

Editing, as a technical expertise, will be obsolete very soon. One might argue that is already obsolete outside of broadcast and high-end post facilities. That is, anywhere where image quality is not critical.

Editing as a creative expertise will survive but the people who do this job will change. Outside of high-end work, the job title is likely to disappear. "Editing" will become a subsidiary task of other professions. Directors and Producers and Journalist already have creative "editing" skills. We are all just "storytellers." These people only lacked a technical craft, one that is no longer difficult to acquire.

The term "Preditor" was created by threatened editors. It is already on the way out. These people are simply producers who can now do their own editing. They have always existed. There are just more of them now.

If you are an editor and you want to keep working, it's time to become an "educer." Tortured, I know. But you get the point.

Cheers,
              tod




On Aug 12, 2016, at 3:56 AM, Oliver evildead@... [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Hi!

I've been a lurker here for a decade or so but I was hoping some of you might want to chime in with your ideas of the future of the tv editing.

Basically, the back story is that I'm an video editor and manager of a dozen or so editors at a TV station in Switzerland, and I'm assuming that the direction in which editing is the same elsewhere as well, journalists doing more of their own editing, less investment in infrastructure, less focus on the craft and more on technology, file handling, etc. These subjects have been preoccupying the 50 or so editors we have here for years now, and in September we're having a brainstorming/future day, and one of the things I think might be helpful is to get some perspective from others in the same situation. It always seems like we're in a vacuum here, and every TV station figures out what they do for themselves, creating redundancies and missed opportunities.

Basically my idea was to have share a small questionnaire among those interested, maybe 5 or 6 questions, and share the results with our editors in September, and of course with the avid list as well.

Anyone out there interested in taking part? I'd be very interested to hear how everyone else around the world is coping...

Thanks,
Oliver

-- 
"I am, sir, a brother of the angle."   - Izaak Walton



 

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Re: [Avid-L2] TV editors opinions desired

 

You are picking the wrong target when you blame it all on the "Bean Counters." They can only cut costs until the quality  is so low that the consumer won't pay to watch. You have to ask yourself, what level is that at? Watch YouTube or most of what is on cable these days and you begin to get an idea. 


In the end, we have ourselves to blame for not educating the consumer on the value we add. Since editors are invisible to the end viewer, how would the viewer even know what good or bad editing is? On the other hand, the consumer thinks the clever back and forth editing in a Tarantino film is all his doing. So why should an editor garner any money when Tarantino did it all?

Terence Curren


---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bigfish@...> wrote :


And of course as an "Educer" I will be paid twice as much since I'm doing two jobs now.  Most Producers I know are now being saddled with so many other production and post tasks that have traditionally been done by other staff members they don't have the time to edit too.  Yes technology has become more accessible and for some strange reason less intimidating but the bottom line is we are in a race to the bottom and as has been pointed out the bean counters wouldn't know a good edit if it was shoved in their place where the sun don't shine.  One of the major ironies is that as I watch all this happen I see how inefficient post has become.  What we did in one or two cuts back in the linear days now takes 10 cuts.  Sure non linear makes that more possible but in my world when I sat with the field director of a piece and we worked together things were much more efficient and given the people in charge were sitting in the room things were completed in a more timely manner.  The fallacy that removing the field directors from the edit room saves money is because the bean  counters can only count personnel and smaller numbers look better but when the piece take 4 or 5 times longer to finish that lower man power ends up costing more in the long run.  That's the reality and lack of understanding the post process that I see all the time. 

---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <hoplist@...> wrote :

This is the natural progression when was any technical expertise becomes obsolete. 

Editing, as a technical expertise, will be obsolete very soon. One might argue that is already obsolete outside of broadcast and high-end post facilities. That is, anywhere where image quality is not critical.

Editing as a creative expertise will survive but the people who do this job will change. Outside of high-end work, the job title is likely to disappear. "Editing" will become a subsidiary task of other professions. Directors and Producers and Journalist already have creative "editing" skills. We are all just "storytellers." These people only lacked a technical craft, one that is no longer difficult to acquire.

The term "Preditor" was created by threatened editors. It is already on the way out. These people are simply producers who can now do their own editing. They have always existed. There are just more of them now.

If you are an editor and you want to keep working, it's time to become an "educer." Tortured, I know. But you get the point.

Cheers,
              tod




On Aug 12, 2016, at 3:56 AM, Oliver evildead@... [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Hi!

I've been a lurker here for a decade or so but I was hoping some of you might want to chime in with your ideas of the future of the tv editing.

Basically, the back story is that I'm an video editor and manager of a dozen or so editors at a TV station in Switzerland, and I'm assuming that the direction in which editing is the same elsewhere as well, journalists doing more of their own editing, less investment in infrastructure, less focus on the craft and more on technology, file handling, etc. These subjects have been preoccupying the 50 or so editors we have here for years now, and in September we're having a brainstorming/future day, and one of the things I think might be helpful is to get some perspective from others in the same situation. It always seems like we're in a vacuum here, and every TV station figures out what they do for themselves, creating redundancies and missed opportunities.

Basically my idea was to have share a small questionnaire among those interested, maybe 5 or 6 questions, and share the results with our editors in September, and of course with the avid list as well.

Anyone out there interested in taking part? I'd be very interested to hear how everyone else around the world is coping...

Thanks,
Oliver

-- 
"I am, sir, a brother of the angle."   - Izaak Walton



 

__._,_.___

Posted by: tcurren@aol.com
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Have you tried the highest rated email app?
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Friday, August 12, 2016

Re: [Avid-L2] TV editors opinions desired

 


And of course as an "Educer" I will be paid twice as much since I'm doing two jobs now.  Most Producers I know are now being saddled with so many other production and post tasks that have traditionally been done by other staff members they don't have the time to edit too.  Yes technology has become more accessible and for some strange reason less intimidating but the bottom line is we are in a race to the bottom and as has been pointed out the bean counters wouldn't know a good edit if it was shoved in their place where the sun don't shine.  One of the major ironies is that as I watch all this happen I see how inefficient post has become.  What we did in one or two cuts back in the linear days now takes 10 cuts.  Sure non linear makes that more possible but in my world when I sat with the field director of a piece and we worked together things were much more efficient and given the people in charge were sitting in the room things were completed in a more timely manner.  The fallacy that removing the field directors from the edit room saves money is because the bean  counters can only count personnel and smaller numbers look better but when the piece take 4 or 5 times longer to finish that lower man power ends up costing more in the long run.  That's the reality and lack of understanding the post process that I see all the time. 

---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <hoplist@...> wrote :

This is the natural progression when was any technical expertise becomes obsolete. 

Editing, as a technical expertise, will be obsolete very soon. One might argue that is already obsolete outside of broadcast and high-end post facilities. That is, anywhere where image quality is not critical.

Editing as a creative expertise will survive but the people who do this job will change. Outside of high-end work, the job title is likely to disappear. "Editing" will become a subsidiary task of other professions. Directors and Producers and Journalist already have creative "editing" skills. We are all just "storytellers." These people only lacked a technical craft, one that is no longer difficult to acquire.

The term "Preditor" was created by threatened editors. It is already on the way out. These people are simply producers who can now do their own editing. They have always existed. There are just more of them now.

If you are an editor and you want to keep working, it's time to become an "educer." Tortured, I know. But you get the point.

Cheers,
              tod




On Aug 12, 2016, at 3:56 AM, Oliver evildead@... [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Hi!

I've been a lurker here for a decade or so but I was hoping some of you might want to chime in with your ideas of the future of the tv editing.

Basically, the back story is that I'm an video editor and manager of a dozen or so editors at a TV station in Switzerland, and I'm assuming that the direction in which editing is the same elsewhere as well, journalists doing more of their own editing, less investment in infrastructure, less focus on the craft and more on technology, file handling, etc. These subjects have been preoccupying the 50 or so editors we have here for years now, and in September we're having a brainstorming/future day, and one of the things I think might be helpful is to get some perspective from others in the same situation. It always seems like we're in a vacuum here, and every TV station figures out what they do for themselves, creating redundancies and missed opportunities.

Basically my idea was to have share a small questionnaire among those interested, maybe 5 or 6 questions, and share the results with our editors in September, and of course with the avid list as well.

Anyone out there interested in taking part? I'd be very interested to hear how everyone else around the world is coping...

Thanks,
Oliver

-- 
"I am, sir, a brother of the angle."   - Izaak Walton


__._,_.___

Posted by: bigfish@pacbell.net
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Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

this is the Avid-L2

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[Avid-L2] Creatives

 

This list has been fascinating for me.

However, I am offline mostly.
Anyone know of a list for offline that correlates roughly
to the quality of info I am finding here?


On Aug 5, 2016, at 6:29 PM, film35hd@yahoo.com [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Awesome that you would get to experience 2-inch quad.  So much of that is now airing on CNN's/Tom Hank's produced 'Decades' series, and a lot of it looks really, really good.  For a composite (mixed together) analog signal of 486 vertical lines [out of 525] (compared to today Component (colors separate from black-and-white luminance) Digital sampled 1080 vertical lines (out of 1125), it was the tube cameras that help back the potential of 2-inch.  And the brilliant engineers who made it all happen, especially when watching an Ampex AVR-2 or RCA TCR-100 cart machine to roll commercials, were really brilliant.


Chip Hess
CFH3 Media
773-293-4824



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Posted by: "C. Hess" <cfh3media@gmail.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (18)

Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

this is the Avid-L2

.

__,_._,___

Re: [Avid-L2] TV editors opinions desired

 

This is the natural progression when was any technical expertise becomes obsolete. 


Editing, as a technical expertise, will be obsolete very soon. One might argue that is already obsolete outside of broadcast and high-end post facilities. That is, anywhere where image quality is not critical.

Editing as a creative expertise will survive but the people who do this job will change. Outside of high-end work, the job title is likely to disappear. "Editing" will become a subsidiary task of other professions. Directors and Producers and Journalist already have creative "editing" skills. We are all just "storytellers." These people only lacked a technical craft, one that is no longer difficult to acquire.

The term "Preditor" was created by threatened editors. It is already on the way out. These people are simply producers who can now do their own editing. They have always existed. There are just more of them now.

If you are an editor and you want to keep working, it's time to become an "educer." Tortured, I know. But you get the point.

Cheers,
              tod




On Aug 12, 2016, at 3:56 AM, Oliver evildead@gmail.com [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Hi!

I've been a lurker here for a decade or so but I was hoping some of you might want to chime in with your ideas of the future of the tv editing.

Basically, the back story is that I'm an video editor and manager of a dozen or so editors at a TV station in Switzerland, and I'm assuming that the direction in which editing is the same elsewhere as well, journalists doing more of their own editing, less investment in infrastructure, less focus on the craft and more on technology, file handling, etc. These subjects have been preoccupying the 50 or so editors we have here for years now, and in September we're having a brainstorming/future day, and one of the things I think might be helpful is to get some perspective from others in the same situation. It always seems like we're in a vacuum here, and every TV station figures out what they do for themselves, creating redundancies and missed opportunities.

Basically my idea was to have share a small questionnaire among those interested, maybe 5 or 6 questions, and share the results with our editors in September, and of course with the avid list as well.

Anyone out there interested in taking part? I'd be very interested to hear how everyone else around the world is coping...

Thanks,
Oliver

-- 
"I am, sir, a brother of the angle."   - Izaak Walton


__._,_.___

Posted by: hoplist@hillmanncarr.com
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (4)

Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

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[Avid-L2] Re: TV editors opinions desired

 

Problem is, the bean counters making the staffing decisions wouldn't be able to recognize quality editing if it hit them in the face.

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Posted by: ashley@creatv.co.za
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Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

this is the Avid-L2

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[Avid-L2] Re: TV editors opinions desired

 

Hi Oliver,

I'm working at Deutsche Welle, Germany's international broadcaster, and we're seeing some of the same trends.

I would gladly participate in your survey.

Generally, I see the trend to use preditors, mostly for monetary reasons. Most people who actually do the work (instead of looking at Excel spreadsheets) prefer the old model of having a dedicated editor.

I think the only way to reverse the trend in the long term is upping our game and aim for even higher quality. That's the thing that sets us apart.

Bye,
Christian

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Posted by: public@braintrash.de
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Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

this is the Avid-L2

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[Avid-L2] TV editors opinions desired

 

Hi!

I've been a lurker here for a decade or so but I was hoping some of you might want to chime in with your ideas of the future of the tv editing.

Basically, the back story is that I'm an video editor and manager of a dozen or so editors at a TV station in Switzerland, and I'm assuming that the direction in which editing is the same elsewhere as well, journalists doing more of their own editing, less investment in infrastructure, less focus on the craft and more on technology, file handling, etc. These subjects have been preoccupying the 50 or so editors we have here for years now, and in September we're having a brainstorming/future day, and one of the things I think might be helpful is to get some perspective from others in the same situation. It always seems like we're in a vacuum here, and every TV station figures out what they do for themselves, creating redundancies and missed opportunities.

Basically my idea was to have share a small questionnaire among those interested, maybe 5 or 6 questions, and share the results with our editors in September, and of course with the avid list as well.

Anyone out there interested in taking part? I'd be very interested to hear how everyone else around the world is coping...

Thanks,
Oliver

--
"I am, sir, a brother of the angle."   - Izaak Walton

__._,_.___

Posted by: Oliver <evildead@gmail.com>
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)

Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

this is the Avid-L2

.

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Thursday, August 11, 2016

Re: [Avid-L2] Re: Remote Desktop Editing With Media Composer

 


@Bogdan.  

Thanks for this ... this is very interesting.  Those latency numbers are really impressive compared to the Slingbox solutions I have used.  

So if I am understanding correctly you are using a BMD Intensity USB 3 as a capture device -- instead of a webcam -- to feed Skype.  Two Questions:  1.  Is Skype only capable of recognizing a USB capture device (as opposed to a PCIe capture card like a Decklink?  2.  Have you ever tried this on a Windows platform?

Thanks in advance. 



---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote :

-BMD Intensity USB3
-DVI to HDMI adapter from Mac monitor1 out to BMD HDMI in
-3.5mm minjack from mac line out to 2xRCA in on intensity
-USB3 from BMD to Mac(Book)PRO
-the remote end running MC should initiate the call

BG

www.finale.tv



From: "justinmenzel@... [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2016 2:43 PM
Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: Remote Desktop Editing With Media Composer

 
Thanks David and Bogdan, 

Bogdan, can you give me your exact setup for video and audio including external devices that you recommend? Either for Mac or Windows, or ideally both.

Thanks!


Justin


 

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Posted by: blafarm@yahoo.com
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Have you tried the highest rated email app?
With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes (Gmail, Outlook, AOL and more) in one place. Never delete an email again with 1000GB of free cloud storage.

this is the Avid-L2

.

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