Saturday, February 9, 2013

Re: [Avid-L2] Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error

 

Hi Rob:

Given that AMA+transcode is typically many times faster than
File+Import, you could argue that Avid is pushing editors down the AMA
route through their software design, and deprecating traditional import.

I guess my expectation of AMA is that if I can link to a file and play
it back, then I ought to be able to edit with it without problems.

If you have a link to documentation on the requirements and limitations
for AMA I'd sure like to read up on it. I've never seen anything from
Avid suggesting AMA shouldn't be used with audio sources, for instance.

Regards,
--Michael

On 13-02-09 3:42 PM, Robert Lawson wrote:
> This is not meant as a criticism of Mr. Brockington, but my experience is
> that many people have the impression that the M in AMA stands for "Magic".
>
> The requirements and limitations for an AMA workflow are well documented
> but the common perception seems to be that AMA should work for everything.
> It doesn't help that Avid relies on 3rd parties to develop their own AMA
> plugins and those 3rd party plugins aren't always easy to find. Sony has
> gotten better but I find Canon's support/download site to be frustrating,
> for example.
>
> I encounter many editors, as well, who forget that File + Import is still a
> perfectly valid workflow for many file formats.
>
> ---
> Rob Lawson
> System Administrator, ACSR ISIS, Windows & Interplay
> CBS News
>
>
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error

 

Hi Job:

I tried using AMA to bring in BWAV files for 2 reasons:

1. I've never seen anything in Avid documentation to suggest this
workflow is unsupported. I see nothing in the Symphony help files, for
instance, and Avid's document "Avid Editing Systems - Supported Formats"
makes no reference to audio formats at all. Avid will link to BWAVs
(and other audio formats) via AMA without complaint -- so why should I
have anticipated a problem?

2. What the Symphony v.6 docs do state is this:
"You should not mix workflows. Either use the AMA method or use
the traditional import/batch import method."
This implies that it's a bad idea to use AMA to bring in video clips
while using traditional import for audio. This is why I tried using AMA
for my audio initially (and quickly gave up on the idea when I saw the
timecode did not come in properly for BWAVs via AMA.)

You may not think this is a bug, but perhaps you would agree the docs
are obscure, if not outright misleading. If this workflow is
unsupported, as it appears to be, then don't you think that should be
made obvious? I'd like to see a warning dialogue when using AMA to link
to unsupported formats.

When I was searching for an answer to why I was getting these
CM_INVALID_TRIM errors and quarantined audio files I found others asking
about the same problem, but no answers for why it might be happening,
which is why I've posted my results at some length.

In that vein, it might be worth noting that this error is not
limited to .wav files -- I had the same problem with .mp3 files which
were AMA'd and transcoded in a project with 'film options' enabled.

Regards,
--Michael

On 13-02-09 1:03 PM, Job ter Burg (L2B) wrote:
>
>
> Michael,
>
> The most important question here is: why are you using AMA to bring in
> BWAV files? AMA was never designed to support this workflow, and by
> using it, you are risking all kinds of issues - depending on the
> project format and sample rate.
>
> BWF/BWAV/WAV is supported through File->Import, and that is the way
> you should go about this. Using AMA will - IIRC - essentially rely on
> whatever the AMA QT plugin passes on to MC. That's not a reliable
> source for this type of file at all.
>
> File->Import has some specific properties that allow for proper BEXT
> chunk metadata extraction as well as proper sample rate handling
> (including pullup/pulldown rates).
>
> Import is the ONLY supported way to bring in BWAV files.
>
> Job
>
> On 9 feb. 2013, at 21:34, Michael Brockington brocking@sfu.ca
> > wrote:
>
> >
> > - import .wav files via AMA, and consolidate them to an empty MXF/1
> folder
> >
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[Avid-L2] Re: Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error

 

In tests I did a while back there was a Resolve setting having to do with maintaining reel names and other metadata necessary for later relinking in Avid after a round trip. I haven't played with it in a while but I'm sure somebody will know the exact settings to make sure are set. Not sure if that will solve your issue but the inability to relink might be related to those setting(s).

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Terence Curren" wrote:
>
> Or Blackmagic could just buy Avid and finally integrate new tools into the color corrector. :-0
>
> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu wrote:
> >
> > Thanks for following up on this Michael. it should save others tons of time and grief.
> > Hopefully Avid will be able to fix it in a patch release.
> >
> > BG
> > www.finale.tv
> >
> > --- On Sat, 2/9/13, Bogdan Grigorescu wrote:
> >
> > From: Bogdan Grigorescu
> > Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error
> > To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Saturday, February 9, 2013, 12:37 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Sat, 2/9/13, Michael Brockington brocking@> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Michael Brockington brocking@>
> >
> > Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error
> >
> > To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Date: Saturday, February 9, 2013, 12:34 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> > I've identified the source of most (perhaps all) of these errors I've
> >
> >
> >
> > been experiencing.
> >
> >
> >
> > I can repeatably generate the problem (CM_INVALID_OFFSET error and
> >
> >
> >
> > quarantining of audio files) by importing .wav files via AMA, and
> >
> >
> >
> > consolidating them. Crucially, Avid will only quarantine the new audio
> >
> >
> >
> > files if they are consolidated in a project for which 'film options'
> >
> >
> >
> > have been selected during project creation.
> >
> >
> >
> > (It's worth noting that this appears to be a bad workflow for other
> >
> >
> >
> > reasons as well. When I AMA-import .wav files, the start timecode field
> >
> >
> >
> > is always 00:00:00:00, whereas the files get a proper start timecode
> >
> >
> >
> > assigned if they are imported the old-fashioned way.)
> >
> >
> >
> > I've attached more detail below, in case anyone wants to try to
> >
> >
> >
> > reproduce the problem.
> >
> >
> >
> > Project type 1080p/23.976 WITH film options (35mm 4 perf):
> >
> >
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> > - import .wav files via AMA, and consolidate them to an empty MXF/1 folder
> >
> >
> >
> > -deselect 'skip media files already on the target drive'
> >
> >
> >
> > -check all audio conversion boxes to 48kHz/16 Bit and PCM (MXF)
> >
> >
> >
> > -choose "Keep masterclips linked to media on the original drive."
> >
> >
> >
> > Files consolidate succesfully, but Avid generates the following error before creating the .mdb database in the MXF folder, and crashes to the desktop after choosing 'continue':
> >
> >
> >
> > Assertion failed: iofRefNum != 0
> >
> >
> >
> > /Snapshots/relengsnow6_1343949798/coresw/core/Projects/Mac/../../src/filesys/coreMacFileLocator.c,
> >
> >
> >
> > Line: 1586
> >
> >
> >
> > When I restart Avid, I get the CM_INVALID_ERROR / Quarantine dialogue before even selecting a project.
> >
> >
> >
> > If I select 'Ignore all' at the Quarantine prompt my consolidated audio stays online (so the newly consolidated masterclips will play inside Avid). If I choose 'Quarantine All', all the newly consolidated audio is moved to the Quarantine folder.
> >
> >
> >
> > If I 'Ignore' rather than quarantining, any future rebuild of the database in that folder will generate the same error.
> >
> >
> >
> > Project type 1080p/23.976 WITHOUT film options:
> >
> >
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> > Same as described above, up until the crash after consolidating.
> >
> >
> >
> > However, on restart, the databases can be successfully rebuilt without triggering quarantine or CM_INVALID_TRIM errors. If I switch to a project WITH film options, I can still rebuild the database in this MXF folder without error -- indicating the problem gets baked in during the consolidation, not during the rebuild.
> >
> >
> >
> > System:
> >
> >
> >
> > -------
> >
> >
> >
> > Avid Symphony 6.0.3
> >
> >
> >
> > Mac 2 x 2.4 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon, OSX 10.7.4, 24 GB RAM
> >
> >
> >
> > ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB
> >
> >
> >
> > On 13-01-28 4:04 PM, Michael wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > I have a MediaFiles folder with about 1953 audio files in MXF media
> >
> >
> >
> > > format, 85GB worth of material.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > When I trash the database files in that folder so Avid can rebuild
> >
> >
> >
> > > them, it quarantines about 1344 files with the error CM_INVALID_TRIM.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > If I move sample files from the quarantine folder back to the original
> >
> >
> >
> > > folder or to a different MediaFiles folder on a different drive, it
> >
> >
> >
> > > still wants to quarantine them.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > If I choose to "Ignore All" errors while rebuilding the database, the
> >
> >
> >
> > > rebuild will proceed, creating a new database file. I can drag the new
> >
> >
> >
> > > .mdb database file into an empty bin, and it populates with 265 clips.
> >
> >
> >
> > > Doing the same thing with the old database, which I've saved from the
> >
> >
> >
> > > Trash populates the bin with 1001 clips. Clearly the rebuilt database
> >
> >
> >
> > > is not indexing all the media in the folder when errors are ignored.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > I don't believe the quarantined audio MXF files are corrupt -- I can
> >
> >
> >
> > > play these MXF files with MXF4MacPlayer.app, and open them with
> >
> >
> >
> > > CalibratedMXFQstat.app. I can also move them back to their original
> >
> >
> >
> > > folder, restore the original database from the Trash, pull the old
> >
> >
> >
> > > database into a bin, and play back sample files that get quarantined
> >
> >
> >
> > > if the database is rebuilt.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > There's no obvious pattern to which files are quarantined, in terms of
> >
> >
> >
> > > creation date, file size or filename. CalibratedMXFQstat.app doesn't
> >
> >
> >
> > > show any unexpected differences between sample files that are
> >
> >
> >
> > > quarantined, and others that are not.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > I've seen a couple reports of similar troubles on the web, but no
> >
> >
> >
> > > solutions for rebuilding the database without quarantining the audio.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Tried fresh user settings, but no help.
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions,
> >
> >
> >
> > > --Michael Brockington
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > -------------------
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Avid Symphony 6.0.3 software-only / OSX 10.7.4 / Mac tower 2.24 GHZ
> >
> >
> >
> > > Quad-core Intel Xeon / 24 GB RAM
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

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[Avid-L2] Re: Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error

 

Or Blackmagic could just buy Avid and finally integrate new tools into the color corrector. :-0

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu wrote:
>
> Thanks for following up on this Michael. it should save others tons of time and grief.
> Hopefully Avid will be able to fix it in a patch release.
>
> BG
> www.finale.tv
>
> --- On Sat, 2/9/13, Bogdan Grigorescu wrote:
>
> From: Bogdan Grigorescu
> Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Saturday, February 9, 2013, 12:37 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Sat, 2/9/13, Michael Brockington brocking@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> From: Michael Brockington brocking@...>
>
> Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] Help for audio files quarantined with CM_INVALID_TRIM error
>
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
>
> Date: Saturday, February 9, 2013, 12:34 PM
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
> I've identified the source of most (perhaps all) of these errors I've
>
>
>
> been experiencing.
>
>
>
> I can repeatably generate the problem (CM_INVALID_OFFSET error and
>
>
>
> quarantining of audio files) by importing .wav files via AMA, and
>
>
>
> consolidating them. Crucially, Avid will only quarantine the new audio
>
>
>
> files if they are consolidated in a project for which 'film options'
>
>
>
> have been selected during project creation.
>
>
>
> (It's worth noting that this appears to be a bad workflow for other
>
>
>
> reasons as well. When I AMA-import .wav files, the start timecode field
>
>
>
> is always 00:00:00:00, whereas the files get a proper start timecode
>
>
>
> assigned if they are imported the old-fashioned way.)
>
>
>
> I've attached more detail below, in case anyone wants to try to
>
>
>
> reproduce the problem.
>
>
>
> Project type 1080p/23.976 WITH film options (35mm 4 perf):
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> - import .wav files via AMA, and consolidate them to an empty MXF/1 folder
>
>
>
> -deselect 'skip media files already on the target drive'
>
>
>
> -check all audio conversion boxes to 48kHz/16 Bit and PCM (MXF)
>
>
>
> -choose "Keep masterclips linked to media on the original drive."
>
>
>
> Files consolidate succesfully, but Avid generates the following error before creating the .mdb database in the MXF folder, and crashes to the desktop after choosing 'continue':
>
>
>
> Assertion failed: iofRefNum != 0
>
>
>
> /Snapshots/relengsnow6_1343949798/coresw/core/Projects/Mac/../../src/filesys/coreMacFileLocator.c,
>
>
>
> Line: 1586
>
>
>
> When I restart Avid, I get the CM_INVALID_ERROR / Quarantine dialogue before even selecting a project.
>
>
>
> If I select 'Ignore all' at the Quarantine prompt my consolidated audio stays online (so the newly consolidated masterclips will play inside Avid). If I choose 'Quarantine All', all the newly consolidated audio is moved to the Quarantine folder.
>
>
>
> If I 'Ignore' rather than quarantining, any future rebuild of the database in that folder will generate the same error.
>
>
>
> Project type 1080p/23.976 WITHOUT film options:
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Same as described above, up until the crash after consolidating.
>
>
>
> However, on restart, the databases can be successfully rebuilt without triggering quarantine or CM_INVALID_TRIM errors. If I switch to a project WITH film options, I can still rebuild the database in this MXF folder without error -- indicating the problem gets baked in during the consolidation, not during the rebuild.
>
>
>
> System:
>
>
>
> -------
>
>
>
> Avid Symphony 6.0.3
>
>
>
> Mac 2 x 2.4 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon, OSX 10.7.4, 24 GB RAM
>
>
>
> ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB
>
>
>
> On 13-01-28 4:04 PM, Michael wrote:
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > I have a MediaFiles folder with about 1953 audio files in MXF media
>
>
>
> > format, 85GB worth of material.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > When I trash the database files in that folder so Avid can rebuild
>
>
>
> > them, it quarantines about 1344 files with the error CM_INVALID_TRIM.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > If I move sample files from the quarantine folder back to the original
>
>
>
> > folder or to a different MediaFiles folder on a different drive, it
>
>
>
> > still wants to quarantine them.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > If I choose to "Ignore All" errors while rebuilding the database, the
>
>
>
> > rebuild will proceed, creating a new database file. I can drag the new
>
>
>
> > .mdb database file into an empty bin, and it populates with 265 clips.
>
>
>
> > Doing the same thing with the old database, which I've saved from the
>
>
>
> > Trash populates the bin with 1001 clips. Clearly the rebuilt database
>
>
>
> > is not indexing all the media in the folder when errors are ignored.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > I don't believe the quarantined audio MXF files are corrupt -- I can
>
>
>
> > play these MXF files with MXF4MacPlayer.app, and open them with
>
>
>
> > CalibratedMXFQstat.app. I can also move them back to their original
>
>
>
> > folder, restore the original database from the Trash, pull the old
>
>
>
> > database into a bin, and play back sample files that get quarantined
>
>
>
> > if the database is rebuilt.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > There's no obvious pattern to which files are quarantined, in terms of
>
>
>
> > creation date, file size or filename. CalibratedMXFQstat.app doesn't
>
>
>
> > show any unexpected differences between sample files that are
>
>
>
> > quarantined, and others that are not.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > I've seen a couple reports of similar troubles on the web, but no
>
>
>
> > solutions for rebuilding the database without quarantining the audio.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > Tried fresh user settings, but no help.
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > Thanks in advance for any suggestions,
>
>
>
> > --Michael Brockington
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > -------------------
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> > Avid Symphony 6.0.3 software-only / OSX 10.7.4 / Mac tower 2.24 GHZ
>
>
>
> > Quad-core Intel Xeon / 24 GB RAM
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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[Avid-L2] MacPro Firewire Buss(es) and transcoding errors?

 

As I am transcoding to DNX 45 from DNX 220 I am getting errors when I try to transcode directly from a 4TB self powered GRaid hooked up to the rear FW 800 connector and FW 800/400 cable hooked up to the other rear FW 800 port and a nexstar -3 external enclosure self powered with a 1TB drive.  The DNX 220 media is on the GRaid and the DNX 45 is going on the nexstar.  I forget the exact error but it stalls at various times with one or more clips in a bin transcoded.  I had a real issue with an hour plus clip and after several tries opted to transcode to the internal raid not the nexstar enclosure which is FW 400.  This worked even though I found an error the next morning the clip actually did transode to the internal raid.  I tried again to day to go direct with a bin full of shorter clips and it errored out after the first clip.  Back to the internal raid and life is good.  I googled and it seems at least for 2006-2008 MacPros there is only one
firewire buss shared with all the ports front and back.  I assume this is still the case but I can't find any info directly addressing this.  Can anyone confirm or deny there is only one firewire buss on a MacPro?  Even if it is only one buss I feel like this shouldn't be an issue to do this transcode from one drive to another on my brand spanking new 12 core MacPro.  The project is running from the desktop so that's not taking up any firewire bandwidth.  Am I mistaken to expect that to work.  Sure seems strange to get something mentioning a codec error when attempting this. 

John Moore

Barking Trout Productions

Studio City, CA

bigfish@pacbell.net

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: [Avid-L2] Isis workspaces

 



I think it's also an add-on board for Nitris DX, not sure if that comes with the badge.

>>
>> If memory serves, NitrisDX boxes with the AVCI hardware codec board can be
>> identified by a label on the front panel. .
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Anyone experimenting with PCIe to Thunderbolt for I/O?

 

Sorry, no. But I have been thinking of doing that exact same set
up with Wirecast. By All Means, please let us know how it goes
installing and using the setup.

Tim Selander
Tokyo, Japan

On 2/9/13 3:28 PM, Dave Spraker wrote:
> I'm getting ready for an install (Wirecast, not Avid) using a customer
> supplied iMac, Magna Thumderbolt PCIe expander and a BMD Quad card. The
> whole expansion chassis idea gives the willies. Anyone had any experience
> recently?
>
>
>
> Dave Spraker
>
>
> Western Rep | EditShare | Maxx Digital | Consulting | Sports Audio
>
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[Avid-L2] Keyspan Adapter for USA-28X B?

 

I've gone to the Tripplite keyspan site to find driver's for my USA-28X B but I can only find the USA-28 XG.  My recollection is the "B" vs. "G" was because the G was ROHS compliant.  Given I can't find the "B" driver I'm going to try the "G" driver.  Can anybody share any experience in this regard.  I don't have a deck handy to check things with right now but will have a deck brought in in the near future so I'm trying to prepare ahead of time.  TIA  Also I recall people had complained that the ROHS compliant Keyspans weren't frame accurate like the older ones.  I've never had a chance to A B or in this case "B G" compare head to head but I've definitely had frame accuracy with the G units using Nitris DX hardware.  On the other hand firewire Mojo SDI's were inconsistent in frame accuracy with Sony digibetas but dead on with Panny DVCPro decks.  Anybody have any tests they've done with Keyspans and frame accuracy?

John Moore

Barking Trout Productions

Studio City, CA

bigfish@pacbell.net

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[Avid-L2] Re: Isis workspaces

 

So it's really AVC Intra and that makes sense with the option board you mentioned at one point in the thread Steve. So even though it AVC Intra, Steve you mentioned it felt very sluggish which led you to believe it was a long GOP format. This sounds like even though it's a valid Avid Codec it's performance might be less than an Avid DNX codec. At least that's what you are describing from you experience on the system. I wouldn't be surprised that even though it's now an Avid "Native Codec" it doesn't work as well as Avid's DNX. At that point I guess it's use would have to be weighed with the ease/speed of ingest from the field cameras verses whatever deleterious performance the editors face. I'm guessing greater more knowledgeable folks have made those assessments already and as always stuck it to the editors. ;-) Of course I've also seen repeatedly cases where production decisions have dictated the post workflow even when there were more efficient approaches available but alas Post is always the last to know.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Steve Hullfish wrote:
>
> Thanks to everyone for their input. This group - and your collective wisdom - is an invaluable resource. I appreciate your generosity for sharing it.
>
> Steve Hullfish
> contributor: www.provideocoalition.com
> author: "The Art and Technique of Digital Color Correction"
>
> On Feb 9, 2013, at 7:22 PM, Andi Meek wrote:
>
> >
> > This is correct, there is a badge on the front.
> >
> > Andi
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: [Avid-L2] Isis workspaces

 

Thanks to everyone for their input. This group - and your collective wisdom - is an invaluable resource. I appreciate your generosity for sharing it.

Steve Hullfish
contributor: www.provideocoalition.com
author: "The Art and Technique of Digital Color Correction"

On Feb 9, 2013, at 7:22 PM, Andi Meek kwikpasta@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> This is correct, there is a badge on the front.
>
> Andi

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