Saturday, February 8, 2014

[Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 

Well it's a good thing you are not our target demographic!!! When I come home in the wee hours of the morning after a double shift I always loath having to herd the Chroma Transients out of my front yard. I have heard they put on a killer set at the Troubadour every now and then. And for the head banger the Horizontal Shifts usually open for them now that the CRT's have faded out of the picture.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Mikeparsons.tv" <mikeparsons.tv@...> wrote:
>
> Actually just this week my day was ruined whilst watching tv in bed when I noticed some chroma transients.
>
> Suffice to say I will not be watching that channel again.
>
> Best regards
>
> Mike
>
> > On 9 Feb, 2014, at 9:47 am, "johnrobmoore" <bigfish@...> wrote:
> >
> > I'll take a look when I'm back in next week on the tape fields. There is a very pronounced difference between play and pause for these over shoots. The Tek scope alarm triggers in pause and not in play. That would indicate that it's not there in play but in pause as far as I know. My understanding is the 1% area relates to what percentage of the frame that is in error and not how many frames in a row have and error. I have seen Harris scopes with a Consecutive Error Sampled parameter but again I think that is across a line of video pixels and not across frames to my knowledge. Perhaps I have this wrong? The area percentage setting is 1% and that doesn't care if the frame is still or moving although when parked I didn't take note of which field the deck was showing the character generator output. The difference isn't very subtle so I doubt I'm just missing in play but of course more will be revealed and I do miss the better raster clarity with the older CRT scopes. Given my safe color limit and the external legalizer I don't think this is anything in the original SDI output from Avid. I've delivered 4 seasons of this show through this system and never once have they flagged anything for this kind of specular transition overshoots. Also these shots were in last weeks show and didn't get flagged, so the polar axis didn't shift and the network didn't go off the air and most importantly the ratings didn't dip with these spikes.
> >
> > --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu <bogdan_grigorescu@> wrote:
> > >
> > > The spikes are probably there even in playback, just less visible.
> > > Try to increase the trace intensity and use line select to position yourself in the offending areas(hot spots, car headlights, fire, flames, etc.)
> > > Then see if you can spot them at normal speed playback.
> > >
> > > Another factor is interlacing. If the format recorded on tape is interlaced and the deck is set to display one field, it could make a difference when you're paused.
> > >
> > > As a last trick, you can set trace persistence to infinity, let the tape run at normal speed, then come back and see the video level swing (both under and over shoot), then decide if you need to intervene.
> > >
> > > BG
> > > http://www.finale.tv
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: John Moore <bigfish@>
> > > To: Avid L2 <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:03 PM
> > > Subject: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Got a QC bounce for levels exceeding 720 millivolts. I have safe color limit set RGB 0 to 700 etc... plus an ensemble external legalizer also set 0 to 700mV. I am aware how both HDCam and to a lesser extent HDCamSr will exhibit specular/transient spikes on level due to their form of compression. What will run error free through my Tek WFM 7020 set to 0% gamut diamond error and Tek default alarm setting will light up like an Xmas tree playing the same sequence back from tape. In consulting with Tektronix setting the alarm area to 1% eliminates the unavoidable alarm triggers on tape playback.
> > >
> > >
> > > Well today's QC of transient levels of 720mV is not on my Avid output only on the HDCam tape playback and it really only happens in pause. Playing through the flagged section is fine but once you hit pause the transient levels appear. Now pre digital I understood more about why in pause levels might shift, still frame chroma adjustment on a VPR-2 anyone ;-), but I'm curious why in a digital format the HDCam jacks the levels a bit in Pause/still. Given the levels are fine in play I told the QC Monkey to kindly pass the show, leaving out the part where I wanted to tell him/her to learn to use the scope properly and stop wasting my weekend time.
> > >
> > > So can anyone enlighten me as to why in our HDCam F-500 transient levels appear in pause? The are little specular like excursion that pop up. It's not like the whole video signal level is jumping up overall. I figure it's the nature of the beast but why?
> > >
> > >
> > > John Moore
> > > Barking Trout Productions
> > > Studio City, CA
> > > bigfish@
> > >
> >
> >
>

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[Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 

Project is 1920x1080 1080i/59.94. Looking at the main output of the deck no cross convert.

I recall you have mentioned before that nothing lower than 1% area is available. The only reason I go to 1% area for the diamond alarm is that at 0% everything triggers the error alarms when set to Tek Default values which use to be High=721mV and Low=-21mV and 0% area IIRC. I noticed on my recently purchased, about a year ago, the Tek Defaults are High=735mV and Low=-35mV and 1% area.

At the last Tek seminar I recall Steven mentioning the Tek defaults mirrow EBU standard as SMPTE doesn't have a comparable published standard. I will have to review the material to get the exact values if they were actually mentioned.

So I will once again state that as an operator out of the Avid I can pass a sequence with Tek default alarms and 0% area but same video back from the deck I have to go to 1% area. Like it or not that's the only recipe I've found that seems to make sense from an operating stand point for tape QC. I'd welcome other people's approaches to the conundrum. In my experience all the alarms on these modern scopes seem to be overly sensitive to be practical with out backing them off in some way shape or form. Be it the alarm levels or the sensitivity however that is measured on a particular unit.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote:
>
> You did not mention the video format yet, nor did you mention which output of the deck is monitored(mainHD, crossconvertHD, downconvertSD, etc.)... if, for instance, the hot levels are on one field, when pausing tape you effectively double their area by repeating the field.
>
> Also, keep in mind that Tektronix refuses (or is technically unable) to offer an in between 0% and 1% step for their scopes and 1% is huge at 192x108 pixels. So 0% is way too low(essentially any sample above the alarm level will register) whereas 1% is too coarse. I discussed this numerous times with both Steve Holmes and Michael Waidson, starting back in 2007 - no solution so far.
>
> BG
> www.finale.tv
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: johnrobmoore <bigfish@...>
> To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 6:47 PM
> Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam
>
>
>
>  
> I'll take a look when I'm back in next week on the tape fields. There is a very pronounced difference between play and pause for these over shoots. The Tek scope alarm triggers in pause and not in play. That would indicate that it's not there in play but in pause as far as I know. My understanding is the 1% area relates to what percentage of the frame that is in error and not how many frames in a row have and error. I have seen Harris scopes with a Consecutive Error Sampled parameter but again I think that is across a line of video pixels and not across frames to my knowledge. Perhaps I have this wrong? The area percentage setting is 1% and that doesn't care if the frame is still or moving although when parked I didn't take note of which field the deck was showing the character generator output. The difference isn't very subtle so I doubt I'm just missing in play but of course more will be revealed and I do miss the better raster clarity with the
> older CRT scopes. Given my safe color limit and the external legalizer I don't think this is anything in the original SDI output from Avid. I've delivered 4 seasons of this show through this system and never once have they flagged anything for this kind of specular transition overshoots. Also these shots were in last weeks show and didn't get flagged, so the polar axis didn't shift and the network didn't go off the air and most importantly the ratings didn't dip with these spikes.
>
> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu <bogdan_grigorescu@> wrote:
> >
> > The spikes are probably there even in playback, just less visible.
> > Try to increase the trace intensity and use line select to position yourself in the offending areas(hot spots, car headlights, fire, flames, etc.)
> > Then see if you can spot them at normal speed playback.
> >
> > Another factor is interlacing. If the format recorded on tape is interlaced and the deck is set to display one field, it could make a difference when you're paused.
> >
> > As a last trick, you can set trace persistence to infinity, let the tape run at normal speed, then come back and see the video level swing (both under and over shoot), then decide if you need to intervene.
> >
> > BG
> > http://www.finale.tv
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: John Moore <bigfish@>
> > To: Avid L2 <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:03 PM
> > Subject: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> > Got a QC bounce for levels exceeding 720 millivolts.  I have safe color limit set RGB 0 to 700 etc... plus an ensemble external legalizer also set 0 to 700mV.  I am aware how both HDCam and to a lesser extent HDCamSr will exhibit specular/transient spikes on level due to their form of compression.  What will run error free through my Tek WFM 7020 set to 0% gamut diamond error and Tek default alarm setting will light up like an Xmas tree playing the same sequence back from tape.  In consulting with Tektronix setting the alarm area to 1% eliminates the unavoidable alarm triggers on tape playback. 
> >
> >
> > Well today's QC of transient levels of 720mV is not on my Avid output only on the HDCam tape playback and it really only happens in pause.  Playing through the flagged section is fine but once you hit pause the transient levels appear.  Now pre digital I understood more about why in pause levels might shift, still frame chroma adjustment on a VPR-2 anyone ;-), but I'm curious why in a digital format the HDCam jacks the levels a bit in Pause/still.  Given the levels are fine in play I told the QC Monkey to kindly pass the show, leaving out the part where I wanted to tell him/her to learn to use the scope properly and stop wasting my weekend time.
> >
> > So can anyone enlighten me as to why in our HDCam F-500 transient levels appear in pause?  The are little specular like excursion that pop up.  It's not like the whole video signal level is jumping up overall.  I figure it's the nature of the beast but why?
> >
> >  
> > John Moore
> > Barking Trout Productions
> > Studio City, CA
> > bigfish@
> >
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 

You did not mention the video format yet, nor did you mention which output of the deck is monitored(mainHD, crossconvertHD, downconvertSD, etc.)... if, for instance, the hot levels are on one field, when pausing tape you effectively double their area by repeating the field.

Also, keep in mind that Tektronix refuses (or is technically unable) to offer an in between 0% and 1% step for their scopes and 1% is huge at 192x108 pixels. So 0% is way too low(essentially any sample above the alarm level will register) whereas 1% is too coarse. I discussed this numerous times with both Steve Holmes and Michael Waidson, starting back in 2007 - no solution so far.

BG


From: johnrobmoore <bigfish@pacbell.net>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 6:47 PM
Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 
I'll take a look when I'm back in next week on the tape fields. There is a very pronounced difference between play and pause for these over shoots. The Tek scope alarm triggers in pause and not in play. That would indicate that it's not there in play but in pause as far as I know. My understanding is the 1% area relates to what percentage of the frame that is in error and not how many frames in a row have and error. I have seen Harris scopes with a Consecutive Error Sampled parameter but again I think that is across a line of video pixels and not across frames to my knowledge. Perhaps I have this wrong? The area percentage setting is 1% and that doesn't care if the frame is still or moving although when parked I didn't take note of which field the deck was showing the character generator output. The difference isn't very subtle so I doubt I'm just missing in play but of course more will be revealed and I do miss the better raster clarity with the older CRT scopes. Given my safe color limit and the external legalizer I don't think this is anything in the original SDI output from Avid. I've delivered 4 seasons of this show through this system and never once have they flagged anything for this kind of specular transition overshoots. Also these shots were in last weeks show and didn't get flagged, so the polar axis didn't shift and the network didn't go off the air and most importantly the ratings didn't dip with these spikes.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote:
>
> The spikes are probably there even in playback, just less visible.
> Try to increase the trace intensity and use line select to position yourself in the offending areas(hot spots, car headlights, fire, flames, etc.)
> Then see if you can spot them at normal speed playback.
>
> Another factor is interlacing. If the format recorded on tape is interlaced and the deck is set to display one field, it could make a difference when you're paused.
>
> As a last trick, you can set trace persistence to infinity, let the tape run at normal speed, then come back and see the video level swing (both under and over shoot), then decide if you need to intervene.
>
> BG
> http://www.finale.tv
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: John Moore <bigfish@...>
> To: Avid L2 <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:03 PM
> Subject: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam
>
>
>
>  
> Got a QC bounce for levels exceeding 720 millivolts.  I have safe color limit set RGB 0 to 700 etc... plus an ensemble external legalizer also set 0 to 700mV.  I am aware how both HDCam and to a lesser extent HDCamSr will exhibit specular/transient spikes on level due to their form of compression.  What will run error free through my Tek WFM 7020 set to 0% gamut diamond error and Tek default alarm setting will light up like an Xmas tree playing the same sequence back from tape.  In consulting with Tektronix setting the alarm area to 1% eliminates the unavoidable alarm triggers on tape playback. 
>
>
> Well today's QC of transient levels of 720mV is not on my Avid output only on the HDCam tape playback and it really only happens in pause.  Playing through the flagged section is fine but once you hit pause the transient levels appear.  Now pre digital I understood more about why in pause levels might shift, still frame chroma adjustment on a VPR-2 anyone ;-), but I'm curious why in a digital format the HDCam jacks the levels a bit in Pause/still.  Given the levels are fine in play I told the QC Monkey to kindly pass the show, leaving out the part where I wanted to tell him/her to learn to use the scope properly and stop wasting my weekend time.
>
> So can anyone enlighten me as to why in our HDCam F-500 transient levels appear in pause?  The are little specular like excursion that pop up.  It's not like the whole video signal level is jumping up overall.  I figure it's the nature of the beast but why?
>
>  
> John Moore
> Barking Trout Productions
> Studio City, CA
> bigfish@...
>



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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 

Actually just this week my day was ruined whilst watching tv in bed when  I noticed some chroma transients.

Suffice to say I will not be watching that channel again.

Best regards

Mike

On 9 Feb, 2014, at 9:47 am, "johnrobmoore" <bigfish@pacbell.net> wrote:

 

I'll take a look when I'm back in next week on the tape fields. There is a very pronounced difference between play and pause for these over shoots. The Tek scope alarm triggers in pause and not in play. That would indicate that it's not there in play but in pause as far as I know. My understanding is the 1% area relates to what percentage of the frame that is in error and not how many frames in a row have and error. I have seen Harris scopes with a Consecutive Error Sampled parameter but again I think that is across a line of video pixels and not across frames to my knowledge. Perhaps I have this wrong? The area percentage setting is 1% and that doesn't care if the frame is still or moving although when parked I didn't take note of which field the deck was showing the character generator output. The difference isn't very subtle so I doubt I'm just missing in play but of course more will be revealed and I do miss the better raster clarity with the older CRT scopes. Given my safe color limit and the external legalizer I don't think this is anything in the original SDI output from Avid. I've delivered 4 seasons of this show through this system and never once have they flagged anything for this kind of specular transition overshoots. Also these shots were in last weeks show and didn't get flagged, so the polar axis didn't shift and the network didn't go off the air and most importantly the ratings didn't dip with these spikes.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote:
>
> The spikes are probably there even in playback, just less visible.
> Try to increase the trace intensity and use line select to position yourself in the offending areas(hot spots, car headlights, fire, flames, etc.)
> Then see if you can spot them at normal speed playback.
>
> Another factor is interlacing. If the format recorded on tape is interlaced and the deck is set to display one field, it could make a difference when you're paused.
>
> As a last trick, you can set trace persistence to infinity, let the tape run at normal speed, then come back and see the video level swing (both under and over shoot), then decide if you need to intervene.
>
> BG
> http://www.finale.tv
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: John Moore <bigfish@...>
> To: Avid L2 <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:03 PM
> Subject: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam
>
>
>
>  
> Got a QC bounce for levels exceeding 720 millivolts.  I have safe color limit set RGB 0 to 700 etc... plus an ensemble external legalizer also set 0 to 700mV.  I am aware how both HDCam and to a lesser extent HDCamSr will exhibit specular/transient spikes on level due to their form of compression.  What will run error free through my Tek WFM 7020 set to 0% gamut diamond error and Tek default alarm setting will light up like an Xmas tree playing the same sequence back from tape.  In consulting with Tektronix setting the alarm area to 1% eliminates the unavoidable alarm triggers on tape playback. 
>
>
> Well today's QC of transient levels of 720mV is not on my Avid output only on the HDCam tape playback and it really only happens in pause.  Playing through the flagged section is fine but once you hit pause the transient levels appear.  Now pre digital I understood more about why in pause levels might shift, still frame chroma adjustment on a VPR-2 anyone ;-), but I'm curious why in a digital format the HDCam jacks the levels a bit in Pause/still.  Given the levels are fine in play I told the QC Monkey to kindly pass the show, leaving out the part where I wanted to tell him/her to learn to use the scope properly and stop wasting my weekend time.
>
> So can anyone enlighten me as to why in our HDCam F-500 transient levels appear in pause?  The are little specular like excursion that pop up.  It's not like the whole video signal level is jumping up overall.  I figure it's the nature of the beast but why?
>
>  
> John Moore
> Barking Trout Productions
> Studio City, CA
> bigfish@...
>

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.

__,_._,___

[Avid-L2] Re: Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 

I'll take a look when I'm back in next week on the tape fields. There is a very pronounced difference between play and pause for these over shoots. The Tek scope alarm triggers in pause and not in play. That would indicate that it's not there in play but in pause as far as I know. My understanding is the 1% area relates to what percentage of the frame that is in error and not how many frames in a row have and error. I have seen Harris scopes with a Consecutive Error Sampled parameter but again I think that is across a line of video pixels and not across frames to my knowledge. Perhaps I have this wrong? The area percentage setting is 1% and that doesn't care if the frame is still or moving although when parked I didn't take note of which field the deck was showing the character generator output. The difference isn't very subtle so I doubt I'm just missing in play but of course more will be revealed and I do miss the better raster clarity with the older CRT scopes. Given my safe color limit and the external legalizer I don't think this is anything in the original SDI output from Avid. I've delivered 4 seasons of this show through this system and never once have they flagged anything for this kind of specular transition overshoots. Also these shots were in last weeks show and didn't get flagged, so the polar axis didn't shift and the network didn't go off the air and most importantly the ratings didn't dip with these spikes.

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Grigorescu <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote:
>
> The spikes are probably there even in playback, just less visible.
> Try to increase the trace intensity and use line select to position yourself in the offending areas(hot spots, car headlights, fire, flames, etc.)
> Then see if you can spot them at normal speed playback.
>
> Another factor is interlacing. If the format recorded on tape is interlaced and the deck is set to display one field, it could make a difference when you're paused.
>
> As a last trick, you can set trace persistence to infinity, let the tape run at normal speed, then come back and see the video level swing (both under and over shoot), then decide if you need to intervene.
>
> BG
> http://www.finale.tv
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: John Moore <bigfish@...>
> To: Avid L2 <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:03 PM
> Subject: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam
>
>
>
>  
> Got a QC bounce for levels exceeding 720 millivolts.  I have safe color limit set RGB 0 to 700 etc... plus an ensemble external legalizer also set 0 to 700mV.  I am aware how both HDCam and to a lesser extent HDCamSr will exhibit specular/transient spikes on level due to their form of compression.  What will run error free through my Tek WFM 7020 set to 0% gamut diamond error and Tek default alarm setting will light up like an Xmas tree playing the same sequence back from tape.  In consulting with Tektronix setting the alarm area to 1% eliminates the unavoidable alarm triggers on tape playback. 
>
>
> Well today's QC of transient levels of 720mV is not on my Avid output only on the HDCam tape playback and it really only happens in pause.  Playing through the flagged section is fine but once you hit pause the transient levels appear.  Now pre digital I understood more about why in pause levels might shift, still frame chroma adjustment on a VPR-2 anyone ;-), but I'm curious why in a digital format the HDCam jacks the levels a bit in Pause/still.  Given the levels are fine in play I told the QC Monkey to kindly pass the show, leaving out the part where I wanted to tell him/her to learn to use the scope properly and stop wasting my weekend time.
>
> So can anyone enlighten me as to why in our HDCam F-500 transient levels appear in pause?  The are little specular like excursion that pop up.  It's not like the whole video signal level is jumping up overall.  I figure it's the nature of the beast but why?
>
>  
> John Moore
> Barking Trout Productions
> Studio City, CA
> bigfish@...
>

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.

__,_._,___

Re: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 

The spikes are probably there even in playback, just less visible.
Try to increase the trace intensity and use line select to position yourself in the offending areas(hot spots, car headlights, fire, flames, etc.)
Then see if you can spot them at normal speed playback.

Another factor is interlacing. If the format recorded on tape is interlaced and the deck is set to display one field, it could make a difference when you're paused.

As a last trick, you can set trace persistence to infinity, let the tape run at normal speed, then come back and see the video level swing (both under and over shoot), then decide if you need to intervene.

BG


From: John Moore <bigfish@pacbell.net>
To: Avid L2 <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:03 PM
Subject: [Avid-L2] Video Levels jump in pause on Sony F-500 HDCam

 
Got a QC bounce for levels exceeding 720 millivolts.  I have safe color limit set RGB 0 to 700 etc... plus an ensemble external legalizer also set 0 to 700mV.  I am aware how both HDCam and to a lesser extent HDCamSr will exhibit specular/transient spikes on level due to their form of compression.  What will run error free through my Tek WFM 7020 set to 0% gamut diamond error and Tek default alarm setting will light up like an Xmas tree playing the same sequence back from tape.  In consulting with Tektronix setting the alarm area to 1% eliminates the unavoidable alarm triggers on tape playback. 

Well today's QC of transient levels of 720mV is not on my Avid output only on the HDCam tape playback and it really only happens in pause.  Playing through the flagged section is fine but once you hit pause the transient levels appear.  Now pre digital I understood more about why in pause levels might shift, still frame chroma adjustment on a VPR-2 anyone ;-), but I'm curious why in a digital format the HDCam jacks the levels a bit in Pause/still.  Given the levels are fine in play I told the QC Monkey to kindly pass the show, leaving out the part where I wanted to tell him/her to learn to use the scope properly and stop wasting my weekend time.

So can anyone enlighten me as to why in our HDCam F-500 transient levels appear in pause?  The are little specular like excursion that pop up.  It's not like the whole video signal level is jumping up overall.  I figure it's the nature of the beast but why?
 
John Moore
Barking Trout Productions
Studio City, CA
bigfish@pacbell.net


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[Avid-L2] Re: Avid's biggest challenges

 

That makes perfect sense for your use. Given I'm just receiving final full length stems the only sample accurate edit is at the end if there is any. Perhaps bouncing a track to the protools equivalent of an audio mixdown/submix track and exporting that for the client. That would eliminate the internal frame accurate edits and would allow the track to contain any processing/EQ the mixer might be adding to the VO/Dialogue track. In my world we never edit first in ProTools but start in Avid and give it to ProTools.

With your workflow do any of the audio effects that might be applied to a dialogue/Vo track carry properly back into Avid MC?

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <jonathansabrams@...> wrote:
>
> ---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bigfish@> wrote:
> I'm curious what issues you have with sample accurate edits. Our mixers just end there stems on a frame boundary and I don't get them when I import back to Avid from the protools aaf. Occasionally they forget and I have a sample accurate edit at the end of the stems which I usually delete the hanging frame. Not a big deal in my work flow.
>
> Now if you are talking about sample accurate audio editing or at least sub frame audio editing in MC that's a different story. Could you elaborate as to what problem there is with the sample accurate edit. Or am I misunderstanding what you are describing?
>
>
>
> The workflow I am referring to has been used in animation projects. I have seen clients who will want to record the voices for their animation first. Pro Tools is used for this and it works brilliantly.
>
>
> The problem arises when the client asks for an AAF of what was recorded and edited in Pro Tools. If the engineer is editing out breaths, etc. then it is difficult at best to have every single edit be on a frame boundary. If all the client wanted was this final audio edit from Pro Tools, maybe these sample accurate edits would not be a problem. Unfortunately, what the client wants is the audio edit from Pro Tools and the continued ability to edit the audio in their NLE. Why they want this ability I do not know. What I do know is that the client gets what the client wants, unless it is not technically possible. With MC, it's not technically possible, unless every single edit in the Pro Tools session is on a frame boundary, which is impractical for the reasons I noted above.
>
>
> Thus, if MC had sample accurate audio editing or at least sub frame audio editing, this problem would be eliminated or reduced. As you know, this is a different story. It's one of the interoperability features that Avid should work on.
>

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[Avid-L2] RE: Avid's biggest challenges

 

Pete and Terry.  You guys nailed it.  Now the ACA makes total sense.  

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Re: [Avid-L2] dual gpu argument for Avid MC on pc vs mac ?

 

And stutter and latency.

From Nvidia
"eliminating screen tearing and minimizing display stutter and input lag"








On 2/8/2014 4:13 PM, namyrb wrote:
Actually gsync is for screen tearing. 

The benefit of sli/cf is upgrade cost. If I have a GTX 670 and want better performance I can either get a more expensive and powerful card, or I can get another GTX 670 for less than the other card. Depending on driver support, SLI can greatly increase performance - sometimes by over 50%, but at least some micro stuttering is always present. It really, really depends on the drivers though. 

On Saturday, February 8, 2014, Dom Q. Silverio <domqsilverio@gmail.com> wrote:
 

Parallel GPU rendering (SLI or Crossfire) where primarily designed for
gaming. Micro-stuttering happens during real-time graphic rendering. As
far as I know, CUDA or Open-CL do not support SLI or Crossfire. If in
the future Open-CL supports Crossfire and micro stuttering becomes an
issue, rendering would bypass the issue.

Avid needs a modern GPU dependent playback and render engine. Currently,
there is no support for CUDA or Open-CL.

FYI - Nvidia just released an add-on hardware for monitor manufacturers
called G-sync to address micro-stuttering.
http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/g-sync

On 2/8/2014 1:16 AM, owen wrote:
> Hi,
> could this be an argument for Avid MC on pc vs mac ?
> hope not.
> http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/02/07/new-mac-pros-support-amds-crossfire-gpu-teaming-but-only-within-windows
>
> owen
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
> .
>


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Re: [Avid-L2] dual gpu argument for Avid MC on pc vs mac ?

 

Actually gsync is for screen tearing. 


The benefit of sli/cf is upgrade cost. If I have a GTX 670 and want better performance I can either get a more expensive and powerful card, or I can get another GTX 670 for less than the other card. Depending on driver support, SLI can greatly increase performance - sometimes by over 50%, but at least some micro stuttering is always present. It really, really depends on the drivers though. 

On Saturday, February 8, 2014, Dom Q. Silverio <domqsilverio@gmail.com> wrote:
 

Parallel GPU rendering (SLI or Crossfire) where primarily designed for
gaming. Micro-stuttering happens during real-time graphic rendering. As
far as I know, CUDA or Open-CL do not support SLI or Crossfire. If in
the future Open-CL supports Crossfire and micro stuttering becomes an
issue, rendering would bypass the issue.

Avid needs a modern GPU dependent playback and render engine. Currently,
there is no support for CUDA or Open-CL.

FYI - Nvidia just released an add-on hardware for monitor manufacturers
called G-sync to address micro-stuttering.
http://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/g-sync

On 2/8/2014 1:16 AM, owen wrote:
> Hi,
> could this be an argument for Avid MC on pc vs mac ?
> hope not.
> http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/02/07/new-mac-pros-support-amds-crossfire-gpu-teaming-but-only-within-windows
>
> owen
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
> .
>

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