Saturday, October 8, 2011

[Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell

 

I was going to mention GoPro also, but you still have to convert the files. MPEG streamclip is your friend.

http://gopro.com/support/final-cut-pro-tips/

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Knut A. Helgeland" <knut@...> wrote:
>
> GoPro HD Hero comes in a motorsports version... Replace AVCHD with H264 .mp4 files.
>
> K
>
>
> On 8. okt. 2011, at 13.48, Tony Quinsee-Jover wrote:
>
> > " Or better yet, folks could stop trying to fit a round peg in a square hole
> > and use pro cameras for pro work..."
> >
> > I entirely agree Terry. However, for in-car dashboard or rear window mount
> > (the purpose to which these cameras were used) the Sony MC1P takes some
> > beating. The Prod Co did ask me "So what's the best way to move forward?" I
> > said "Use a better camera" then they pointed me to what the camera system
> > was, and I was stuck for a suggestion as to a cost-effective alternative.
> >
> > http://www.sony.co.uk/biz/product/nxcamcorders/hxr-mc1p/overview
> >
> > Tony
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell

 

Link.

http://gopro.com/cameras/hd-motorsports-hero-camera/

K
On 8. okt. 2011, at 15.08, Knut A. Helgeland wrote:

> GoPro HD Hero comes in a motorsports version... Replace AVCHD with H264 .mp4 files.
>
> K
>
>
> On 8. okt. 2011, at 13.48, Tony Quinsee-Jover wrote:
>
>> " Or better yet, folks could stop trying to fit a round peg in a square hole
>> and use pro cameras for pro work..."
>>
>> I entirely agree Terry. However, for in-car dashboard or rear window mount
>> (the purpose to which these cameras were used) the Sony MC1P takes some
>> beating. The Prod Co did ask me "So what's the best way to move forward?" I
>> said "Use a better camera" then they pointed me to what the camera system
>> was, and I was stuck for a suggestion as to a cost-effective alternative.
>>
>> http://www.sony.co.uk/biz/product/nxcamcorders/hxr-mc1p/overview
>>
>> Tony
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell

 

GoPro HD Hero comes in a motorsports version... Replace AVCHD with H264 .mp4 files.

K

On 8. okt. 2011, at 13.48, Tony Quinsee-Jover wrote:

> " Or better yet, folks could stop trying to fit a round peg in a square hole
> and use pro cameras for pro work..."
>
> I entirely agree Terry. However, for in-car dashboard or rear window mount
> (the purpose to which these cameras were used) the Sony MC1P takes some
> beating. The Prod Co did ask me "So what's the best way to move forward?" I
> said "Use a better camera" then they pointed me to what the camera system
> was, and I was stuck for a suggestion as to a cost-effective alternative.
>
> http://www.sony.co.uk/biz/product/nxcamcorders/hxr-mc1p/overview
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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RE: [Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell

 

" Or better yet, folks could stop trying to fit a round peg in a square hole
and use pro cameras for pro work..."

I entirely agree Terry. However, for in-car dashboard or rear window mount
(the purpose to which these cameras were used) the Sony MC1P takes some
beating. The Prod Co did ask me "So what's the best way to move forward?" I
said "Use a better camera" then they pointed me to what the camera system
was, and I was stuck for a suggestion as to a cost-effective alternative.

http://www.sony.co.uk/biz/product/nxcamcorders/hxr-mc1p/overview

Tony

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Friday, October 7, 2011

[Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell

 

Well, it appears my posts are taking about 9 hours to make it to Yahoo today....

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Terence Curren" <tcurren@...> wrote:
>
> I was kind of answering two different things at the same time. AMA workflow is the solution to not having to reimport entire files in the uprez stage.
>
> Converting externally is the best way to deal with these nasty consumer formats like AVCHD for now. Hopefully they will be supported by AMA eventually.
>
> Or better yet, folks could stop trying to fit a round peg in a square hole and use pro cameras for pro work...
>
> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Michael" <mhancockeditor@> wrote:
> >
> > You can't AMA avchd can you? Or do you mean convert to dnxhd quicktimes, AMA those, offline, etc...?
> >
> > It would help if MC could AMA avchd though. Version 6 maybe?
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: "Terence Curren" <tcurren@>
> > Sender: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 16:27:00
> > To: <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> > Reply-To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell
> >
> > My point is, convert them externally to DNxHD and then batch import them. The import process will be MUCH faster and it won't hang.
> >
> > This is one good argument for the AMA workflow. Mount your movies via AMA, Convert to offline resolution and edit. Then in online, remount AMA and relink to hi-res version.
> >
> > Doesn't help you at this point though.
> >
> > --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Tony Quinsee-Jover" <tony@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Trouble is they won't then batch-import. Remember this is a conform job.
> > >
> > >
> > > HD Heaven Media Limited (company no: 07061040) is registered in England and
> > > Wales at Sapphire Heights Courtyard, 31 Tenby Street North, Birmingham B1
> > > 3ES
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
> > > Terence Curren
> > > Sent: 07 October 2011 16:44
> > > To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [Avid-L2] Re: AVCHD Hell
> > >
> > >
> > > Or convert them externally to Avid.
> > >
> > > --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Tony Quinsee-Jover" <tony@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Thanks Steve.
> > > >
> > > > T.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > HD Heaven Media Limited (company no: 07061040) is registered in
> > > > England and Wales at Sapphire Heights Courtyard, 31 Tenby Street
> > > > North, Birmingham B1 3ES
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com] On
> > > > Behalf Of Steve Hullfish
> > > > Sent: 07 October 2011 16:35
> > > > To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] AVCHD Hell
> > > >
> > > > There was just a thread on this.
> > > >
> > > > For some reason - a bug? - if you try importing too many AVCHD files
> > > > at once, it will choke on one of the files that hangs everything FOREVER.
> > > >
> > > > If you do them one at a time or in smaller (though still relatively
> > > > large
> > > > batches) it will import quite quickly.
> > > >
> > > > The actual import of the files isn't bad. I just did an entire project
> > > > like this. When I did 60 files at once, it would inevitably hang on a
> > > > single file. In batches of 20 or 30 files at a time, they came in pretty
> > > quickly.
> > > >
> > > > It's a pain, but that's the solution as far as I can tell.
> > > >
> > > > Steve Hullfish
> > > > contributor: www.provideocoalition.com
> > > > author: "The Art and Technique of Digital Color Correction"
> > > > co-author: "Color Correction for Video: revised edition," "Avid Xpress
> > > > Pro Editing Workshop" and "Avid XpressDV On the Spot"
> > > > presenter: Class On Demand's "Complete Training for Avid Media
> > > > Composer" AND "Complete Training for Apple Color"
> > > > www.classondemand.net/media/final-cut-training/color01.aspx
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Oct 7, 2011, at 7:49 AM, Tony Quinsee-Jover wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi guys,
> > > > >
> > > > > I've asked this question on the Avid forums, but knowing that all
> > > > > the best minds hang out here I thought this might actually be a
> > > > > better place to pose my dilemma.
> > > > > Our client offlined a half hour (24 min) show in PAL 16:9 using
> > > > > maybe 30% HD mts files from a Panasonic MC1P camera. They pulled all
> > > > > these files in at
> > > > > 10:1 on their MC. I now have to online this show. It will be
> > > > > finished on DS, but this question isn't DS related. This is also
> > > > > Prog 1 of a series of shows, so this workflow needs to get nailed.
> > > > > I opened the sequence on MC and consolidated it with 10f handles.
> > > > > I selected "Batch Import" on the MC from the consolidated sequence,
> > > > > selected MXF2:1, and pointed it to all the mts files.
> > > > > After 48 hours MC still hadn't imported 50% of the files and the
> > > > > file it was currently working on said that it had 34 hours to go!
> > > > > Those files which had been imported appeared to be full length,
> > > > > rather than consolidated, meaning that many of them were 30 minutes
> > > > > or more, for maybe 1 sec used.
> > > > > It's been suggested that I'm asking a lot of a 32 bit application to
> > > > > not only import but also rescale all the horrid files, so would I be
> > > > > better importing them at HD (say DNxHD 185) and then switching back
> > > > > to my SD timeline and then consolidating the media to SD? Would MC
> > > > > then only be converting the few seconds used instead of the whole file?
> > > > > Sorry if this last sentence is using some wrong terminology, but I'm
> > > > > no expert on MC these days.
> > > > > Cheers in advance,
> > > > > Tony
> > > > >
> > > > > HD Heaven Media Limited (company no: 07061040) is registered in
> > > > > England and Wales at Sapphire Heights Courtyard, 31 Tenby Street
> > > > > North, Birmingham B1 3ES
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
> > > > http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
> > > http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: Squeeze H.264 Bad Video Level Mystery

 

I think generally QuickTime, thus Squeeze in this case, prefers RGB.

On 10/7/2011 8:38 PM, blafarm wrote:
> Thanks for that explanation.
>
> Is it your opinion, that Squeeze prefers 709 over RGB?
>
> Or have I just lucked-into a group of settings that finally allows me to see unity between the source file in my Avid timeline -- and the H.264 file created in Squeeze with my gamma and saturation tweeks?
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Dom Q. Silverio"<domqsilverio@...> wrote:
>> FFDShow is a set of codecs. Normally it should not interfere with the
>> decoding "normal" QT codecs like Avid as Squeeze usually use it for
>> other formats like XiVD and such. But I did come across your problem and
>> one of the steps I took was removing the FFDshow codecs.
>>
>> Considering your recent post, I don't think FFDshow is the culprit. I
>> think this is just another QT app that cannot interpret the color space
>> information correctly (again). I think this is one of the reasons why
>> even Apple has given up on QT 7 (though QT X is not perfect either).
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/7/2011 8:22 PM, blafarm wrote:
>>> Thanks for your response Dom.
>>>
>>> I just determined the following:
>>>
>>> 1. Squeeze seems to want an Avid exported 709 file -- and not RGB
>>>
>>> 2. Using 709 - I can apply a Squeeze -13 gamma shift - and pretty much nail the gamma. I have tested this by re-importing the resulting H.264 file (Avid import set to 0-255) and comparing it to the source shot on my timeline -- both visually and with BMD Ultrascope out of my MojoDX.
>>>
>>> 3. At that point, I need to add +3 of Squeeze saturation to resolve the chroma differences between the two.
>>>
>>> Based on those findings, does that change your opinion of the possible necessity of uninstalling FFDShow (which, for the record, I did install with Squeeze)?
>>>
>>> And can you please tell me why removing that app might change the outcome -- as I'm using Squeeze's MainConcept H.264 codec?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Dom Q. Silverio"<domqsilverio@> wrote:
>>>> If you installed it with Squeeze, try uninstalling the FFDShow codecs.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 10/7/2011 7:03 PM, blafarm wrote:
>>>>> Just tested a slew of Gamma adjustments (in both directions) in Squeeze 7 -- and it definitely doesn't seem like it's Gamma.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also tested exporting 709 QT and using that as a source for compressions -- again -- and still no joy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Can't figure out why Avid can export an H.264 that is in "unity" with the timeline -- but Squeeze cannot.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I'd use Avid, but the quality level is terrible.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "blafarm"<blafarm@> wrote:
>>>>>> Thanks for your response.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The source files are Cannon 5D imported as RGB.
>>>>>> The Avid project is YCbCR 709.
>>>>>> And I exported all of the QT's as RGB.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At first I thought it might be gamma.
>>>>>> Then I thought it might 0-255 vs. 16-235 mapping.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My Squeeze presets are "known quantities".
>>>>>> And I realize I could get into the filter thing...
>>>>>> But I was hoping to find the [possible] error of my ways.
>>>>>> And just nail this problem without a lot of trial and error.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Cook<jeff@> wrote:
>>>>>>> Not sure about Squeeze, but a problem with Cleaner used to be that
>>>>>>> anybody could overwrite the presets without necessarily knowing it, so
>>>>>>> check that you're not using altered settings.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Otherwise, and unless it's a bug, can you add a video filter inside
>>>>>>> Squeeze and get good levels out that way? Only other thing that occurs
>>>>>>> just now is, are you sure it's the black levels and not a gamma/gray
>>>>>>> levels issue?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Jeff Cook
>>>>>>> jeff@
>>>>>>> 703-980-1104 (cell)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> CookStudios.com
>>>>>>> Freelance Video Editing
>>>>>>> Washington DC& Portable
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Quoting blafarm<blafarm@>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Every H.264 file we create in Sorenson Squeeze 7 (PC) has elevated
>>>>>>>> black levels and reduced contrast. If I didn't know better I would
>>>>>>>> have thought it was a RGB vs. 709 issue -- but I think we've
>>>>>>>> disproved that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We have exported test files from Avid (PC) using three different
>>>>>>>> types of uncompressed QuickTime RGB (0-255) files -- Same as Source,
>>>>>>>> Avid Codecs and Avid 1:1x.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And to check them for "unity" -- we re-imported them back into Avid
>>>>>>>> as RGB -- and they match perfectly with the timeline.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Then we imported those uncompressed QuickTime files into Squeeze and
>>>>>>>> compressed them using three different types of H.264 codecs --
>>>>>>>> MainConcept, Apple and Sorenson.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We have viewed all of these compressed files in QuickTime, Windows
>>>>>>>> Media Player, VLC, Firefox, Chrome and Internet Explorer -- and they
>>>>>>>> all have the same black and contrast problem.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The we imported all of the H.264 files back into Avid as RGB -- and
>>>>>>>> they exhibit the exact same problem -- and do not match the timeline.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Finally, we exported an H.264 file directly out of Avid -- which I
>>>>>>>> believe uses QuickTime codecs -- and the video levels are fine. And
>>>>>>>> then we re-imported that Avid H.264 file back into Avid as RGB --
>>>>>>>> and the levels match the timeline perfectly.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I realize H.264 colorspace is different -- but the black level and
>>>>>>>> contrast differences we are seeing are significant. More confusing
>>>>>>>> -- is that the Avid H.264 export matches the timeline perfectly.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And, lastly, the "Black Normalization to 16" checkbox in Squeeze 7
>>>>>>>> -- has had absolutely no affect in any of our tests.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Anyone else see this problem -- or have a solution?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
>>>>>>>> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

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[Avid-L2] Re: Squeeze H.264 Bad Video Level Mystery

 

Thanks for that explanation.

Is it your opinion, that Squeeze prefers 709 over RGB?

Or have I just lucked-into a group of settings that finally allows me to see unity between the source file in my Avid timeline -- and the H.264 file created in Squeeze with my gamma and saturation tweeks?

--- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Dom Q. Silverio" <domqsilverio@...> wrote:
>
> FFDShow is a set of codecs. Normally it should not interfere with the
> decoding "normal" QT codecs like Avid as Squeeze usually use it for
> other formats like XiVD and such. But I did come across your problem and
> one of the steps I took was removing the FFDshow codecs.
>
> Considering your recent post, I don't think FFDshow is the culprit. I
> think this is just another QT app that cannot interpret the color space
> information correctly (again). I think this is one of the reasons why
> even Apple has given up on QT 7 (though QT X is not perfect either).
>
>
>
>
>
> On 10/7/2011 8:22 PM, blafarm wrote:
> > Thanks for your response Dom.
> >
> > I just determined the following:
> >
> > 1. Squeeze seems to want an Avid exported 709 file -- and not RGB
> >
> > 2. Using 709 - I can apply a Squeeze -13 gamma shift - and pretty much nail the gamma. I have tested this by re-importing the resulting H.264 file (Avid import set to 0-255) and comparing it to the source shot on my timeline -- both visually and with BMD Ultrascope out of my MojoDX.
> >
> > 3. At that point, I need to add +3 of Squeeze saturation to resolve the chroma differences between the two.
> >
> > Based on those findings, does that change your opinion of the possible necessity of uninstalling FFDShow (which, for the record, I did install with Squeeze)?
> >
> > And can you please tell me why removing that app might change the outcome -- as I'm using Squeeze's MainConcept H.264 codec?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Dom Q. Silverio"<domqsilverio@> wrote:
> >> If you installed it with Squeeze, try uninstalling the FFDShow codecs.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 10/7/2011 7:03 PM, blafarm wrote:
> >>> Just tested a slew of Gamma adjustments (in both directions) in Squeeze 7 -- and it definitely doesn't seem like it's Gamma.
> >>>
> >>> Also tested exporting 709 QT and using that as a source for compressions -- again -- and still no joy.
> >>>
> >>> Can't figure out why Avid can export an H.264 that is in "unity" with the timeline -- but Squeeze cannot.
> >>>
> >>> And I'd use Avid, but the quality level is terrible.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "blafarm"<blafarm@> wrote:
> >>>> Thanks for your response.
> >>>>
> >>>> The source files are Cannon 5D imported as RGB.
> >>>> The Avid project is YCbCR 709.
> >>>> And I exported all of the QT's as RGB.
> >>>>
> >>>> At first I thought it might be gamma.
> >>>> Then I thought it might 0-255 vs. 16-235 mapping.
> >>>>
> >>>> My Squeeze presets are "known quantities".
> >>>> And I realize I could get into the filter thing...
> >>>> But I was hoping to find the [possible] error of my ways.
> >>>> And just nail this problem without a lot of trial and error.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Cook<jeff@> wrote:
> >>>>> Not sure about Squeeze, but a problem with Cleaner used to be that
> >>>>> anybody could overwrite the presets without necessarily knowing it, so
> >>>>> check that you're not using altered settings.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Otherwise, and unless it's a bug, can you add a video filter inside
> >>>>> Squeeze and get good levels out that way? Only other thing that occurs
> >>>>> just now is, are you sure it's the black levels and not a gamma/gray
> >>>>> levels issue?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Jeff Cook
> >>>>> jeff@
> >>>>> 703-980-1104 (cell)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> CookStudios.com
> >>>>> Freelance Video Editing
> >>>>> Washington DC& Portable
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Quoting blafarm<blafarm@>:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Every H.264 file we create in Sorenson Squeeze 7 (PC) has elevated
> >>>>>> black levels and reduced contrast. If I didn't know better I would
> >>>>>> have thought it was a RGB vs. 709 issue -- but I think we've
> >>>>>> disproved that.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We have exported test files from Avid (PC) using three different
> >>>>>> types of uncompressed QuickTime RGB (0-255) files -- Same as Source,
> >>>>>> Avid Codecs and Avid 1:1x.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> And to check them for "unity" -- we re-imported them back into Avid
> >>>>>> as RGB -- and they match perfectly with the timeline.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Then we imported those uncompressed QuickTime files into Squeeze and
> >>>>>> compressed them using three different types of H.264 codecs --
> >>>>>> MainConcept, Apple and Sorenson.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We have viewed all of these compressed files in QuickTime, Windows
> >>>>>> Media Player, VLC, Firefox, Chrome and Internet Explorer -- and they
> >>>>>> all have the same black and contrast problem.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The we imported all of the H.264 files back into Avid as RGB -- and
> >>>>>> they exhibit the exact same problem -- and do not match the timeline.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Finally, we exported an H.264 file directly out of Avid -- which I
> >>>>>> believe uses QuickTime codecs -- and the video levels are fine. And
> >>>>>> then we re-imported that Avid H.264 file back into Avid as RGB --
> >>>>>> and the levels match the timeline perfectly.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I realize H.264 colorspace is different -- but the black level and
> >>>>>> contrast differences we are seeing are significant. More confusing
> >>>>>> -- is that the Avid H.264 export matches the timeline perfectly.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> And, lastly, the "Black Normalization to 16" checkbox in Squeeze 7
> >>>>>> -- has had absolutely no affect in any of our tests.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Anyone else see this problem -- or have a solution?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks in advance.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
> >>>>>> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

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Re: [Avid-L2] Re: Squeeze H.264 Bad Video Level Mystery

 

FFDShow is a set of codecs. Normally it should not interfere with the
decoding "normal" QT codecs like Avid as Squeeze usually use it for
other formats like XiVD and such. But I did come across your problem and
one of the steps I took was removing the FFDshow codecs.

Considering your recent post, I don't think FFDshow is the culprit. I
think this is just another QT app that cannot interpret the color space
information correctly (again). I think this is one of the reasons why
even Apple has given up on QT 7 (though QT X is not perfect either).

On 10/7/2011 8:22 PM, blafarm wrote:
> Thanks for your response Dom.
>
> I just determined the following:
>
> 1. Squeeze seems to want an Avid exported 709 file -- and not RGB
>
> 2. Using 709 - I can apply a Squeeze -13 gamma shift - and pretty much nail the gamma. I have tested this by re-importing the resulting H.264 file (Avid import set to 0-255) and comparing it to the source shot on my timeline -- both visually and with BMD Ultrascope out of my MojoDX.
>
> 3. At that point, I need to add +3 of Squeeze saturation to resolve the chroma differences between the two.
>
> Based on those findings, does that change your opinion of the possible necessity of uninstalling FFDShow (which, for the record, I did install with Squeeze)?
>
> And can you please tell me why removing that app might change the outcome -- as I'm using Squeeze's MainConcept H.264 codec?
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "Dom Q. Silverio"<domqsilverio@...> wrote:
>> If you installed it with Squeeze, try uninstalling the FFDShow codecs.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/7/2011 7:03 PM, blafarm wrote:
>>> Just tested a slew of Gamma adjustments (in both directions) in Squeeze 7 -- and it definitely doesn't seem like it's Gamma.
>>>
>>> Also tested exporting 709 QT and using that as a source for compressions -- again -- and still no joy.
>>>
>>> Can't figure out why Avid can export an H.264 that is in "unity" with the timeline -- but Squeeze cannot.
>>>
>>> And I'd use Avid, but the quality level is terrible.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, "blafarm"<blafarm@> wrote:
>>>> Thanks for your response.
>>>>
>>>> The source files are Cannon 5D imported as RGB.
>>>> The Avid project is YCbCR 709.
>>>> And I exported all of the QT's as RGB.
>>>>
>>>> At first I thought it might be gamma.
>>>> Then I thought it might 0-255 vs. 16-235 mapping.
>>>>
>>>> My Squeeze presets are "known quantities".
>>>> And I realize I could get into the filter thing...
>>>> But I was hoping to find the [possible] error of my ways.
>>>> And just nail this problem without a lot of trial and error.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --- In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Cook<jeff@> wrote:
>>>>> Not sure about Squeeze, but a problem with Cleaner used to be that
>>>>> anybody could overwrite the presets without necessarily knowing it, so
>>>>> check that you're not using altered settings.
>>>>>
>>>>> Otherwise, and unless it's a bug, can you add a video filter inside
>>>>> Squeeze and get good levels out that way? Only other thing that occurs
>>>>> just now is, are you sure it's the black levels and not a gamma/gray
>>>>> levels issue?
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jeff Cook
>>>>> jeff@
>>>>> 703-980-1104 (cell)
>>>>>
>>>>> CookStudios.com
>>>>> Freelance Video Editing
>>>>> Washington DC& Portable
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Quoting blafarm<blafarm@>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Every H.264 file we create in Sorenson Squeeze 7 (PC) has elevated
>>>>>> black levels and reduced contrast. If I didn't know better I would
>>>>>> have thought it was a RGB vs. 709 issue -- but I think we've
>>>>>> disproved that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We have exported test files from Avid (PC) using three different
>>>>>> types of uncompressed QuickTime RGB (0-255) files -- Same as Source,
>>>>>> Avid Codecs and Avid 1:1x.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And to check them for "unity" -- we re-imported them back into Avid
>>>>>> as RGB -- and they match perfectly with the timeline.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Then we imported those uncompressed QuickTime files into Squeeze and
>>>>>> compressed them using three different types of H.264 codecs --
>>>>>> MainConcept, Apple and Sorenson.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We have viewed all of these compressed files in QuickTime, Windows
>>>>>> Media Player, VLC, Firefox, Chrome and Internet Explorer -- and they
>>>>>> all have the same black and contrast problem.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The we imported all of the H.264 files back into Avid as RGB -- and
>>>>>> they exhibit the exact same problem -- and do not match the timeline.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Finally, we exported an H.264 file directly out of Avid -- which I
>>>>>> believe uses QuickTime codecs -- and the video levels are fine. And
>>>>>> then we re-imported that Avid H.264 file back into Avid as RGB --
>>>>>> and the levels match the timeline perfectly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I realize H.264 colorspace is different -- but the black level and
>>>>>> contrast differences we are seeing are significant. More confusing
>>>>>> -- is that the Avid H.264 export matches the timeline perfectly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And, lastly, the "Black Normalization to 16" checkbox in Squeeze 7
>>>>>> -- has had absolutely no affect in any of our tests.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyone else see this problem -- or have a solution?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
>>>>>> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

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