Friday, July 29, 2016

Re: [Avid-L2] ISIS 5000 question

 

Each track of DNx175x is 22MB/s. A single 5500 Chassis in all play is rated at 350MB/s.

This will give you 15.9 total streams that can be played. The 10GigE client can use the bandwidth for the entire engine, you will likely want to limit the I/O for that computer under devices.

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Re: [Avid-L2] ISIS 5000 question

 

Yes I'm talking about the ISIS 5000/5500.

one of the client will be using the 10 Gb E and the others will use the 1 Gb E.
The project is a series of 30 min. scripted dramas at 1080p/23.976 , DNXHD 175x + sound, music, SFX and laff tracks. I'm just wondering if we can safely work at this resolution without stuttering.

Thanks

Marcel


On 29-07-2016, at 1:07 PM, SurferRob@aol.com [Avid-L2] wrote:



Are you talking about the ISIS 5000/5500? Most 5000/5500s have a single 10GigE NIC and you can directly attach a client to this. 

Normally this connection is used for a switch. ISIS has been replaced with NEXIS. 


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Posted by: Marcel Brassard <bncrcaxlr@gmail.com>
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[Avid-L2] Re: ISIS 5000 question

 

Are you talking about the ISIS 5000/5500? Most 5000/5500s have a single 10GigE NIC and you can directly attach a client to this.

Normally this connection is used for a switch. ISIS has been replaced with NEXIS.

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Re: [Avid-L2] ISIS 5000 question

 

Marcel,

You don't say what project type you plan to work it so I can't give you any numbers.

A single 1GigE connection will achieve between 100 - 110MB/s. You can do the math (and the MB to Mb conversion) on how many streams will fit down the wire.

We also support a 2x1GigE connection that will achieve between 180-200MB/s. We call this Avid Adaptive Load Balancing - it doesn't require any teaming or NIC bonding and is simply a matter of connecting an additional 1GigE connection. 

This is an extremely common as it is a very lost cost method to add performance and redundancy.

Bob

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Re: [Avid-L2] ISIS 5000 question

 

Thanks for the info Rob.

What is the maximum DNXHD resolution that 4 clients connected to a single 1GbE port can expect to acheive without stuttering of playback?

Thanks,

Marcel


On 26-07-2016, at 8:58 AM, SurferRob@aol.com [Avid-L2] wrote:

SIS and NEXIS both support 10Gbase T - Copper Ethernet to a client. NEXIS also support Twinax cables.
Please let me know if you have any specific questions.

Robert Russo <robert.russo@avid.com>
Sr. Principal Product Designer | Broadcast Storage & Editor 

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Posted by: Marcel Brassard <bncrcaxlr@gmail.com>
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Thursday, July 28, 2016

Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

You can use dedicated signal generators or use your NLE's SDI/HDMI output. Test patterns can be downloaded form the internet. If you do use your NLE, use an external scope to make sure the levels are correct. As you know, software don't always output the way you think they should.

We use ChromaPure for the client monitor. For the computer monitor, we utilize the i1Profiler that came bundled with i1Display Pro. As Bruno stated, Calman and Lightspace are excellent and popular choices.



Dom Q. Silverio

On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 5:49 PM, bruno@mansi.demon.co.uk [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:





---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bigfish@...> wrote :

What would be the signal path to use the X-Rite1 probe on a consumer 4K monitor?  Would you have to feed it an HDMI out of the computer running the X-Rite calibration software? ----

The best way I've found to achieve professional results is to use either the Calman software (from Spectracal) or the Lightspace CMS (from Light Illusion). They're both excellent at profiling/calibrating a display and give you a number of options for getting the test patches onto a monitor. Apart from the expensive option of a dedicated hardware patch generator, they both provide software patch generators for monitors directly connected to a PC or Mac. If you have Blackmagic hardware to feed your monitor, you can use Davinci Resolve to talk to the software and create the necessary patches. The Calman software will also talk to an Amazon Firestick (which plugs into your monitor's HDMI input) to display the necessary patches. Once you've profiled your display there are options to calibrate your monitor in a number of ways.

1) Using your monitor's own controls/adjustments
2) Creating a LUT which can be loaded into supported monitors (eg. Eizo, Flanders)
3) Creating a LUT that can be loaded into a LUT box (eg. AJA LUT box, Fuji IS mini) which sits between the workstation output and the monitor input.

Bruno







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Posted by: "Dom Q. Silverio" <domqsilverio@gmail.com>
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Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 




---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bigfish@...> wrote :

What would be the signal path to use the X-Rite1 probe on a consumer 4K monitor?  Would you have to feed it an HDMI out of the computer running the X-Rite calibration software? ----

The best way I've found to achieve professional results is to use either the Calman software (from Spectracal) or the Lightspace CMS (from Light Illusion). They're both excellent at profiling/calibrating a display and give you a number of options for getting the test patches onto a monitor. Apart from the expensive option of a dedicated hardware patch generator, they both provide software patch generators for monitors directly connected to a PC or Mac. If you have Blackmagic hardware to feed your monitor, you can use Davinci Resolve to talk to the software and create the necessary patches. The Calman software will also talk to an Amazon Firestick (which plugs into your monitor's HDMI input) to display the necessary patches. Once you've profiled your display there are options to calibrate your monitor in a number of ways.

1) Using your monitor's own controls/adjustments
2) Creating a LUT which can be loaded into supported monitors (eg. Eizo, Flanders)
3) Creating a LUT that can be loaded into a LUT box (eg. AJA LUT box, Fuji IS mini) which sits between the workstation output and the monitor input.

Bruno




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Posted by: bruno@mansi.demon.co.uk
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Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

I have the X-Rite i1 probe that I use with the Sony auto balance software on my PVM-2451.  I have also used the probe with the X-Rite software to calibrate my GUI monitors.  It's been a while since I did that so my mind has flushed all the details.  Damn short term memory loss.  With the Sony software hooked up through Ethernet it creates or the monitor creates the test signals that the probe detects.  When I adjusted my GUI monitors it was the X-rite software that created patterns on the Computer monitor that the probe detected. 

What would be the signal path to use the X-Rite1 probe on a consumer 4K monitor?  Would you have to feed it an HDMI out of the computer running the X-Rite calibration software?  I'm no monitor engineer so I've only dabbled with the probe but I would assume that just like I had to do with the GUI monitors I'd have to go into the TV display adjustment menus to tweak things along the way.  I found my GUI monitors that are two of the same model but seem to be different production runs differed in my ability to dial them in.  I forget if it was color temp or some other adjustment involving R G and B adjustments that I just couldn't get one of the monitors to get into the allowable range.  Still the monitors were better matched especially noticeable was turning down the overall brightness to set the monitors to 100 nits or Candelas per meter squared, please correct my units if they are wrong it's been a while.  Getting the GUI down to 100 matches my PVM 2541 OLED that is balanced for 100 nits by the probe settings.

Another thing I learned in the process it that the factory settings for my PVM 2541 seemed very different than my new probe based auto white balance.  I was told by Sony that the PVMs tended to be set up at the factory to balance at 150 nits because they were considered to be field monitors so the brighter setup helped in the less than desirable field environment.  This explained why I saw such a drastic change between probe balance and factory preset.

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Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

HI Dom,

Thank you very much.

Paul


From: "'Dom Q. Silverio' domqsilverio@gmail.com [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: "Avid-L2" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2016 9:42:08 AM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

Spyder is OK. X-Rite i1Display Pro is faster and more accurate at low end of the spectrum (20% and below)

With calibration, it does not matter if it is a consumer or professional display. The tools and process still apply. In our experience, monitors from companies like TVLogic, Flanders and such are well calibrated out of the box. They are neutral with the gamma being on target at 2.2. Consumer TV out of the box tends to be cooler, brighter and gamma all over the place.



Dom Q. Silverio

On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 9:27 AM, paulsulsky@comcast.net [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Hi,

How well do you think a commercial monitor would work with Spyder calibration?





Best Wishes,

Paul


From: "Bogdan Grigorescu bogdan_grigorescu@yahoo.com [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: "Avid-L2" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>, bigfish@pacbell.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 11:11:03 PM

Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 


I've seen the monitor at NAB and it was pretty impressive. 
I believe it has an LG panel and it's limited to about 400nits for HDR(as opposed to 1000nits for the X300).
Viewing angles a bit narrow(30-40 degrees off center, after which it turns greenish). Other than that all goodies that come with OLED: deep blacks, wide gamut, etc. 

let me ask our editors about BMD accuracy. I think it may've been solved after 10.6.5 drivers. 
Most of our systems are on BMD Decklink extreme, but there is one that I kept for outputs to tape as NitrisDX, recently upgraded to DNxIO(we actually switch back and forth between BOBs, depending on UniversalMastering needs).
Will get them to test that too.

BG





From: "bigfish@pacbell.net [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 
Thanks for pointing that one out.  Months back I remember a thread that had an LED sony.  How new is this one?  I think the last monitor shoot out at the editors lounge I was told there was no PVM 4K OLED and they didn't really promise one in the future.  That's better than 30K but still a big chunk.  I like to think of certain things like a proper monitor as the price of admission but clearly in this day and age that's subject to interpretation or in many cases misinterpretation.

Have you seen this monitor in action?  As I'm a fan of the HD PVM 2541 would I be happy with this display?  I'm not going to hold my breath but I can dream.


Also Mr. Bodgan,
You were the one who gave me tips on deck template setting to change to possibly make the Black Magic I/O SD SDI card do proper digital cut inserts but they never worked for me.  I believe at a later time I asked if you had ever got that to work and you still hadn't.  It's been a while so I'll ask again if you were ever successful with digital cuts from Avid using BM I/O?  Have you any DNxIO units at your workplace?


---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote :


$ 23249.16

Sony 55-inch 4K TRIMASTER EL OLED high grade picture PVM-X550

Buy Sony 55-inch 4K TRIMASTER EL OLED high grade picture monitor Review Sony Production Monitors, Monitors




From: "John Moore bigfish@... [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: yahoogroups <avid-l2@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 5:28 PM
Subject: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

At my main clients production company they are going to perhaps move my online bay to a bigger room.  We are doing more 4K shows in the future and I'm thinking it's probably a good time to suggest adding a DNxIO to our Avid Symphony NitrisDX setup.  I know in the past there were/are issues with digital cuts using BlackMagic IO.  There is an edit timing issue where the edit begins with a frame of black as the sequence timeline rolls one frame late.  To the best of my knowledge that has never been fixed but I don't have a setup to test it with now.  Obviously for 4K work tape output is a moot point as far as I can see but given we will still be producing HD content that might involve some tape deliverables I'm wondering where the DNxIO stands on the digital cut problem.  Has Avid fixed it with their own special Video Desktop software that differs from the Black Magic generic version, or so I've read about?

Besides tape out in HD I'm wondering what are people using for 4K monitoring?  The gold standard for the emerging HDR world seems to be the Sony BVM OLED monitor.  I am very happy with my PVM 2541 OLED for HD work and given Netflix work is speced to BT.709 for 4K delivery it would seem using the PVM on an HD downconvert would be a reasonably accurate way to monitor and color correct but short of the 30K Sony BVM what are some decent looking grading monitor?  I see HDMI 1.4 will handle UHD at 8 bit but that's a bit limiting for color correction isn't it?  Are most people running Quad Link HD SDI to the grading monitor?  The few 4K projects I've pushed through our SNDX were shot at True 4K, short for pain in the ass 4K, at 4096x2160.  To monitor that on my HD monitor I set it to letter box slightly to keep correct aspect ration.  If we get a real 4K grading monitor fed with Quad Link HDSDI I would assume it's going to be UHD 16:9 aspect ratio so would the Avid also send it a letter box version for True HD content just like I see in the HD output of my NitrsDX?

My brain really begins to hurt with all the little gotcha along the way and my gut says to just keep working in an HD downconvert scenario where my tektronix scope works as does my existing monitoring but I really think it's time to push forward into the 4K world in a proper manner.  I could see getting a decent 4K program monitor and still scoping on an HD downconvert as a possible compromise but I just feel dirty doing things that way. 

Perhaps it's time to suggest at work they opt for a trash can mac as the 12 core 3.33 GHz mac towers may start to show their age especially when doing 4K in Avid world.  I hate to go in the thunderbolt2 connection world but the whole place is mac based so I don't know of another way to stay mac and get improved Avid 4K performance.  Can anyone compare an Avid 4K workflow with the mac tower 12 core I mentioned to a reasonable level mac trash can?  Would the performance improvement merit jumping into a trash can?  I doubt they want to spend the bucks but I figure I should try and get some reasonable background for them.
 
John Moore Barking Trout Productions Studio City, CA bigfish@...












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Posted by: paulsulsky@comcast.net
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Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

Spyder is OK. X-Rite i1Display Pro is faster and more accurate at low end of the spectrum (20% and below)

With calibration, it does not matter if it is a consumer or professional display. The tools and process still apply. In our experience, monitors from companies like TVLogic, Flanders and such are well calibrated out of the box. They are neutral with the gamma being on target at 2.2. Consumer TV out of the box tends to be cooler, brighter and gamma all over the place.



Dom Q. Silverio

On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 9:27 AM, paulsulsky@comcast.net [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Hi,

How well do you think a commercial monitor would work with Spyder calibration?





Best Wishes,

Paul


From: "Bogdan Grigorescu bogdan_grigorescu@yahoo.com [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: "Avid-L2" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>, bigfish@pacbell.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 11:11:03 PM

Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 


I've seen the monitor at NAB and it was pretty impressive. 
I believe it has an LG panel and it's limited to about 400nits for HDR(as opposed to 1000nits for the X300).
Viewing angles a bit narrow(30-40 degrees off center, after which it turns greenish). Other than that all goodies that come with OLED: deep blacks, wide gamut, etc. 

let me ask our editors about BMD accuracy. I think it may've been solved after 10.6.5 drivers. 
Most of our systems are on BMD Decklink extreme, but there is one that I kept for outputs to tape as NitrisDX, recently upgraded to DNxIO(we actually switch back and forth between BOBs, depending on UniversalMastering needs).
Will get them to test that too.

BG





From: "bigfish@pacbell.net [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 
Thanks for pointing that one out.  Months back I remember a thread that had an LED sony.  How new is this one?  I think the last monitor shoot out at the editors lounge I was told there was no PVM 4K OLED and they didn't really promise one in the future.  That's better than 30K but still a big chunk.  I like to think of certain things like a proper monitor as the price of admission but clearly in this day and age that's subject to interpretation or in many cases misinterpretation.

Have you seen this monitor in action?  As I'm a fan of the HD PVM 2541 would I be happy with this display?  I'm not going to hold my breath but I can dream.


Also Mr. Bodgan,
You were the one who gave me tips on deck template setting to change to possibly make the Black Magic I/O SD SDI card do proper digital cut inserts but they never worked for me.  I believe at a later time I asked if you had ever got that to work and you still hadn't.  It's been a while so I'll ask again if you were ever successful with digital cuts from Avid using BM I/O?  Have you any DNxIO units at your workplace?


---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <bogdan_grigorescu@...> wrote :


$ 23249.16

Sony 55-inch 4K TRIMASTER EL OLED high grade picture PVM-X550

Buy Sony 55-inch 4K TRIMASTER EL OLED high grade picture monitor Review Sony Production Monitors, Monitors




From: "John Moore bigfish@... [Avid-L2]" <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
To: yahoogroups <avid-l2@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 5:28 PM
Subject: [Avid-L2] 4K Monitoring Choices with DNxIO?

 

At my main clients production company they are going to perhaps move my online bay to a bigger room.  We are doing more 4K shows in the future and I'm thinking it's probably a good time to suggest adding a DNxIO to our Avid Symphony NitrisDX setup.  I know in the past there were/are issues with digital cuts using BlackMagic IO.  There is an edit timing issue where the edit begins with a frame of black as the sequence timeline rolls one frame late.  To the best of my knowledge that has never been fixed but I don't have a setup to test it with now.  Obviously for 4K work tape output is a moot point as far as I can see but given we will still be producing HD content that might involve some tape deliverables I'm wondering where the DNxIO stands on the digital cut problem.  Has Avid fixed it with their own special Video Desktop software that differs from the Black Magic generic version, or so I've read about?

Besides tape out in HD I'm wondering what are people using for 4K monitoring?  The gold standard for the emerging HDR world seems to be the Sony BVM OLED monitor.  I am very happy with my PVM 2541 OLED for HD work and given Netflix work is speced to BT.709 for 4K delivery it would seem using the PVM on an HD downconvert would be a reasonably accurate way to monitor and color correct but short of the 30K Sony BVM what are some decent looking grading monitor?  I see HDMI 1.4 will handle UHD at 8 bit but that's a bit limiting for color correction isn't it?  Are most people running Quad Link HD SDI to the grading monitor?  The few 4K projects I've pushed through our SNDX were shot at True 4K, short for pain in the ass 4K, at 4096x2160.  To monitor that on my HD monitor I set it to letter box slightly to keep correct aspect ration.  If we get a real 4K grading monitor fed with Quad Link HDSDI I would assume it's going to be UHD 16:9 aspect ratio so would the Avid also send it a letter box version for True HD content just like I see in the HD output of my NitrsDX?

My brain really begins to hurt with all the little gotcha along the way and my gut says to just keep working in an HD downconvert scenario where my tektronix scope works as does my existing monitoring but I really think it's time to push forward into the 4K world in a proper manner.  I could see getting a decent 4K program monitor and still scoping on an HD downconvert as a possible compromise but I just feel dirty doing things that way. 

Perhaps it's time to suggest at work they opt for a trash can mac as the 12 core 3.33 GHz mac towers may start to show their age especially when doing 4K in Avid world.  I hate to go in the thunderbolt2 connection world but the whole place is mac based so I don't know of another way to stay mac and get improved Avid 4K performance.  Can anyone compare an Avid 4K workflow with the mac tower 12 core I mentioned to a reasonable level mac trash can?  Would the performance improvement merit jumping into a trash can?  I doubt they want to spend the bucks but I figure I should try and get some reasonable background for them.
 
John Moore Barking Trout Productions Studio City, CA bigfish@...











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Posted by: "Dom Q. Silverio" <domqsilverio@gmail.com>
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