This IS the Avid L2: Re: [Avid-L2] Cine Deck does insert Edits? Somebody Pinch me

Friday, April 17, 2015

Re: [Avid-L2] Cine Deck does insert Edits? Somebody Pinch me

Now, normally a digital copy is fine, but we've all seen corrupted files, varying from total loss to glitches.

(aka 'bitrot')"

Whatever you want to call it when I have a perfect QT ref out of Avid and then export to ProRes and end up with a green glitch that isn't in the original I have a problem. Viewing the confidence channel that is reading the actual file I just inserted to is just as valid as a traditional tape confidence head is to me. The fact that this is happening in real time as I output is huge. We always send our tapes and files out to be QC'd and after fixes they spot check the fixes not the whole file or tape. Traditional file exports are the whole file so that spot QC isn't really valid with a file but that's what happens. Now with Cine Deck it is more valid to spot check QC fixes. Nothings perfect, not even tape, but this is a huge workflow step for me and a tremendous time saver.

---In avid-l2@yahoogroups.com, <bouke@...> wrote :

Confidence on a digital file is normally done by using a CRC or SHA (or whatever). This is basically a bit of math on the bytes, and that results in a number.

The receiving part will do the math again, and if the outcome is different it's sure 'something' has changed.

This means, you never can assume your data gets over exactly identical if you don't use such a mechanism.

As a result, any new copy of your file HAS to be QC'd again, even if you did not do anything to it.

For changing files as described, you would need a way hipper validation system to know that your copy is indeed identical on the places you did not touch.

I doubt this exists (but as always in software engineering, it 'could' be done.)

Now, normally a digital copy is fine, but we've all seen corrupted files, varying from total loss to glitches.

(aka 'bitrot')

Bouke

VideoToolShed
van Oldenbarneveltstraat 33
6512 AS NIJMEGEN, the Netherlands
+31 24 3553311

----- Original Message -----
From: bigfish@... [Avid-L2]
To: Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2015 2:31 AM
Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] Cine Deck does insert Edits? Somebody Pinch me

The rewrapping of the file by Cine Deck, for a out of house master file so to speak, does not change the file essence right? In that sense only the new insert might have to be re QC'd but in the interest of being thorough wouldn't it seem prudent to re QC the entire file to verify the Cine Deck's rewrapping of a non native to Cine Deck file? My main application would be knowing that my Cine Deck file I just output from my Avid is just as valid a master as any tape output I've done watching it's confidence head as I output. The out of house files would need more scrutiny in my book.

---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <tcurren@...> wrote :

It's not just the export time. You have now created a new master file. Which means it needs to be QCed in it's entirety again. With Cinedeck you can just QC the insert.

---In Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com, <jeff@...> wrote :

You simply re-wrap a pro-res recorded elsewhere- and then you can punch into it- figure 12 minutes to re-wrap an hour long prores.

DNX quicktimes you can just punch into with Cinedeck.

The Clipster/Fuze doesn't have punch in- you put a fix in manually with your DPX timeline, then re-export. If a Rhode schwartz product is dealing with a non-dpx, you need to re-ingest and re-export the whole shebang. This is where Cinedeck shines.

JDS

Jeff Sengpiehl | Chief Engineer
Chainsaw, Inc.
940 N. Orange Drive
Los Angeles CA, 90038

Phone 323 - 785 - 1550
Direct 323 - 328 - 1608
http://www.chainsawedit.com
Jeff@...

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On Apr 16, 2015, at 3:02 PM, bigfish@... [Avid-L2] <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

The Cine Deck is even hipper than the "Hipster" app Greg H. used at Fremont street to guide me to a "Sloppy Weiner" at the BunkHouse. While QT Pro has this ability you have to flatten it out, resave, to end up with a single file. That takes time, time I don't waste when inserting on tape. The Cine Deck will punch in an insert but still it's a single file ready to go. This is what I was told when I asked if it was using some AS-11 type of pointers trickery to accomplish the insert. So I edit in my change into the file that comes back with QC fixes or just creative changes and I'm done just like tape. That's the way I'm understanding it. As far as this being easy then why isn't everybody doing it? Venice can't right now so I was told at Rhode Schwartz. Bottom line a deck like file recorder will save me the 3 hours ish of rebaking a long form show every time there is a change.

The multiple outputs to record more than one file at a time is also attractive as long as I can punch into my second output file at the same time. I'm told the insert is codec dependent so ProRes and DNX will insert but something like H.264 won't. There are several other codec choices but I don't know which ones will insert edit. It did sound like most of the delivery codecs would support an insert.

I see that Greg H. mentions later in this thread that the Cine Deck only works on it's own files. That I didn't know but it's not a deal breaker for me.

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