Well, it still could have been a improper setting describing either the source files or the projection system. But I think the real point is that this whole DCP making process is easy to get wrong.
So I think you have a very valid point that I shouldn't jump to conclusions and blame the software without knowing more of the specifics of how it was processed. Operator error is as likely an option.
Jay
On Mar 7, 2013, at 1:51 PM, bouke wrote:
> Hmm.
> This indeed suggests something very funky, as one would think it's just
> compression, not any form of altering the levels / colors / gamma / yadda...
> And it makes a decent test with all possible variables ironed out...
> Nothing i can say more...
>
> Bouke
>
> VideoToolShed
> van Oldenbarneveltstraat 33
> 6512 AS NIJMEGEN
> The Netherlands
> +31 24 3553311
> www.videotoolshed.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jay Mahavier" <jay_mahavier@earthlink.net>
> To: <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 5:55 PM
> Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] [OT] DCP File Creation
>
>
> I hear your concerns about the color space conversion, and QT. But you may
> find it interesting that the source for making the DCP was a TIFF sequence
> that was already in XYZ. That's how we were provided it from the grading
> facility. We also have a rec709 SR tape of it. But we decided to use the
> XYZ TIFF sequence for our DCP. So I'm not at all sure why the DCP from
> EasyDCP was on the bright side. And it wasn't horribly bright, but just
> noticeable to someone who would be looking for it.
>
> Jay
>
> On Mar 7, 2013, at 9:20 AM, bouke wrote:
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Jay Mahavier" <jay_mahavier@earthlink.net>
>> To: <Avid-L2@yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 12:58 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Avid-L2] [OT] DCP File Creation
>>
>>
>>> By turnkey I mean that they sell the software and hardware as a bundle.
>>> There are cards in the CPU that they use to accelerate the processing.
>>> And
>>>> that's how they sell it. I'm sorry if that outrages you, but it's their
>>> toy and if that's how they want to sell it then that is their
>>> prerogative.
>> ----------
>> Well, that wasn't aimed at you, but we have had the discussion here
>> numerous
>> times before,
>> where lots of people think that a 'dedicated box' will always outperfrorm
>> a
>> software product...
>> (Needless to say i'm in the other camp)
>> ------------
>>
>>
>> http://www.dvs.de/products/video-systems/clipster.html
>>
>> http://www.easydcp.com
>>
>>
>> As for the comparison of the DCP files, we did look at the two files in
>> the
>> same theater on the same projector. They were both made form the same
>> source files. It was decided to redo the DCP file for an audio fix. Now,
>> I
>> didn't operate either system that processed the DCP, and there may have
>> been
>> a setting in EasyDCP that was set wrong by the operator. But from what
>> was
>> shown to me there are very few options to select in EasyDCP as compared to
>> Clipster. Clipster was actually quite overwhelming with the number of
>> options and controls it had available while making the DCP file. EasyDCP
>> had a very limited amount of options and was, well, easy by comparison.
>> So,
>> yeah, maybe a setting was overlooked somewhere that would have made a
>> difference. And that is probably worth noting for anyone who may use
>> EasyDCP. Or Clipster for that matter. But I'm relating my experience
>> with
>> the two different systems for what it is worth, or not worth. If we had
>> more time before the screening I would have suggested having the EasyDCP
>> system have another go at it, but there was not going to be enough time to
>> have it processed again.
>>
>> --------------
>> Of course having more options is nice. Same as in everything in this
>> industry, a gazillion things can go wrong with 709 / RGB / Gamma to the
>> XYZ
>> color space, and a lot of codecs are not reliable to do what they intend
>> to
>> do (hence the 'die QuickTime die!' that is heard a lot...)
>> There are recepies on the net using ImageMagic to do proper conversion,
>> about a gazzilion parameters you need to set.
>> This is relative new technology, and even the old prooven ones are not
>> clear
>> yet, so i'm afraid we'll having the same conversation in 10 years...
>> Last but not least, there always be companies that will pay a premium for
>> just a tiny bit of quality added, or to ease the workflow.
>> Since the productions i do have a max production budget of about 100K, i
>> need to be on the el-cheapo side.
>> (Not to mention i'm Dutch with Jewish blood.)
>> --------------
>> And Avid does still sell turnkey systems. They just aren't editing
>> systems
>> anymore. They are storage system.
>>
>> ---------
>> Yup, don't you love it?
>> But nowadays people at least know it's normal IT work, albeit customized.
>> Bouke
>> ----------
>>
>> Jay
>>
>>
>> On Mar 7, 2013, at 5:14 AM, bouke wrote:
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Jay Mahavier" <jay_mahavier@earthlink.net>
>>>
>>>> Now, I recently was helping on a short film and had a DCP of it
>>>> processed
>>>> through both Clipster and EasyDCP.
>>>> The one from Clipster looked more
>>>> like what we had expected it to look like from the grading sessions.
>>>> The
>>>> one from EasyDCP was bright by comparison.
>>>
>>> Jay, this says absolutely nothing at all without some more information.
>>> First, i don't buy the 'turn key' box stuff. Avid used to be a 'turn key'
>>> box
>>> ("no, this is not a mac with software and a special graphical card, this
>>> is
>>> an 'avid'...)
>>> It's all done in software, and price has not necceserally to do with
>>> quality. Speed neither.
>>>
>>> If you say one was brighter:
>>> Did you look at both files on the same playout system?
>>> Was this playout set up to match the grading looks?
>>> Where both DCP files made from the same source?
>>> Did both guys who made the output know what they were doing?
>>>
>>> Bouke
>>>
>>> VideoToolShed
>>> van Oldenbarneveltstraat 33
>>> 6512 AS NIJMEGEN
>>> The Netherlands
>>> +31 24 3553311
>>> www.videotoolshed.com
>>>
>>>
>>> Jay
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mar 6, 2013, at 5:28 PM, Benjamin Hershleder wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks Bouke!
>>>> I'll investigate further.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> B
>>>> ----
>>>> Benjamin Hershleder
>>>> Book: http://tinyurl.com/avidmc-book
>>>> Site: http://ContactBen.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 6, 2013, at 3:16 PM, bouke wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Benjamin Hershleder" Ben@ContactBen.com>
>>>>> -,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Two questions:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1-
>>>>>> Can anyone recommend a place (preferably in Los Angeles)
>>>>>> to get a DCP (Digital Cinema Package) file for theatrical exhibition?
>>>>>
>>>>> No.
>>>>>
>>>>>> 2-
>>>>>> Is it really going to cost about $40/minute (i.e. $3,600 for a 90
>>>>>> minute
>>>>>> film)?
>>>>>
>>>>> No.
>>>>> It can be done with (free) open source stuff, and with a decent
>>>>> computer
>>>>> it
>>>>> will be done in less than a day.
>>>>> There are young kids who will do this for a couple of hundred or less.
>>>>> Even I can do it, but have not yet been able to test, and i don't have
>>>>> that
>>>>> much demand, unless it is very last minute.
>>>>> So, you should be done for less than 1K, and 500 would be a fair price
>>>>> if
>>>>> it's just straight copy.
>>>>> If you have a (small) theatre you can bug to toy around, do it
>>>>> yourself.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bouke
>>>>>
>>>>> VideoToolShed
>>>>> van Oldenbarneveltstraat 33
>>>>> 6512 AS NIJMEGEN
>>>>> The Netherlands
>>>>> +31 24 3553311
>>>>> www.videotoolshed.com
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TIA!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> B
>>>>>> ----
>>>>>> Benjamin Hershleder
>>>>>> Book: http://tinyurl.com/avidmc-book
>>>>>> Site: http://ContactBen.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Wear It In Post!
>>>>>> Fun T-shirts, mousepads, mugs & more
>>>>>> for Post Production Professionals
>>>>>> http://www.WearItInPost.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
>>>> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
>>> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at:
>> http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Search the official Complete Avid-L archives at: http://archives.bengrosser.com/avid/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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